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Min

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  1. Like
    Min reacted to fedssocr in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    There are other ways to be generous beyond money. Just being nice and clean probably goes a long way in reputation points. Listening to their stories, as you obviously enjoy doing, is likely to be very appreciated as well. I am not especially demanding in bed which I think is probably also appreciated.
  2. Like
    Min got a reaction from ichigo in My long-awaited and glorious return to Thailand   
    You won’t even go to Pattaya?
  3. Like
    Min reacted to reader in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    No, not harsh at all. And I’m sure he got the message.
    Going back several years, a guy I had gone to for massage many times and treated well messaged me for absurd amount. I replied that I have so save my money for next trip. 
    There’s only one guy I’d send money to and he never asks.
  4. Like
    Min got a reaction from BL8gPt in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
  5. Like
    Min reacted to numazu in Bangkok Trip Report 2022: The wait is over. What was I waiting for?   
    Introduction
    If this pandemic has ever taught me anything, is that to never take anything for granted ever again.
    My last trip to Thailand was in December 2019. That trip was the only Thailand trip I had that year, having prioritized Brazil and Colombia that year. I was already figuring out that Brazil catered more to my evolving taste for both boys, sex and entertainment, but I was still wanting to go to Thailand because of the food, the locations, and yes, of course the boys. Thailand's unwillingness to reopen as soon as others have (during the pandemic), however, has given me the opportunity to visit Brazil more, thus deepening my connection to that country, at the expense of the Land of Smiles. Throughout all that though, I've been trying to go back to Thailand since it always will hold a special place in my heart.
    I remember my last international trip before air travel was paused during the pandemic. No surprise, it was to Brazil. I remember entering Sao Paulo on March 17, 2020. The plane was half full, the streets of Sao Paulo where empty, and everyone was sheltering in place, even if Carnaval ended just 3 weeks before. On March 19, Brazil closed its land borders.  After that, I finally decided to go back home on March 23, 2020, fearing that flights back to the USA would be cancelled eventually.  And I was right. On March 27 they announced that Brazil would close all its borders, even air, on March 30.

    Thailand had a similar thought process, closing its land borders on March 18, and then all borders on March 26, 2020.
    I know that I am not the only one to think that this pandemic was only going to be 2-week thing when it started. And then a month rolled by, and then 3 months. Since I was just at home, my routine started to change. I exercised more. Ate better. I did more video calls, both for work, and for friends far away, similarly stuck at home, wondering when this will all end. I’ve gotten lots of desperate cries for money from boys (Brazil, Thailand, Colombia) without any incomes with all the saunas and clubs closed. Though it all, I thought I did pretty good for myself, and actually was able to focus on other important things that I wouldn’t normally would have without the urgency of the pandemic looming all over us.
    I was pained of course, as I had plans to go Thailand over Songkran in 2020:
    And then something miraculous happened: Brazil decided to open up again. July 30 was the date, so after only 4 months of staying put, I was able to travel again. And it was glorious. Less people in airports and airport parking which meant less time needing to be at the airport. Less people flying which means either instant upgrades to Business class, or having a row to myself in economy. Less stupid tourists clogging up the streets, and less people in the streets in general. And yeah, you had to wear a mask in the plane, but at that point, I’ve gotten used to it, and counted myself lucky to still be even traveling to care.
    And with Brazil’s infinite wisdom, most of the clubs in Rio and Sao Paulo opened up as well, which meant that I was sometimes the only gringo at the premises.  I certainly made the most of it, judging from these trip reports:
     
    Through it all though, I’ve had Thailand in the back of my mind.  When the hell will it ever open up? 2021 rolled around. Apart from my monthly, multi-week trips to Brazil, I’ve pretty much scoured most of Western Europe, the Middle East and Mexico. But Thailand has remained closed. (I’ve also have been keeping my eye on Japan, which is still in a weird reopening phase. I’ve been dying to return.) I see domino after domino of COVID restrictions fall down. Except Thailand. I shared this in August 2021:
    Then the Phuket sandbox happened in July 2021, and while appealing, still was too restrictive for me. And news about the bars still closed was disheartening. Then Thai Pass was introduced in November 2021, and that felt more appealing to me, though the RT-PCR requirement, and the quarantine hotel requirement was something that was a bit unnerving to me. It just introduced (perhaps unnecessary) wildcards to a supposedly wonderful trip. I’d rather just go straight to Brazil, (even with their evolving COVID requirements as well – from medical insurance requirements, to COVID test, to having scrapped everything as of April 2022), and their open bars.
    I finally bit the bullet and bought my ticket to Bangkok last April. I was heading to Dubai in June, and found it interesting to instead head over to Bangkok after that trip instead of high-tailing it back to California. Also, Thailand dropping the COVID test requirement for vaccinated travelers was the deciding factor for me as well. The COVID dominos were starting to fall in Thailand.  The June 12 announcement that the USA was dropping its COVID testing requirement to enter the USA was another domino falling that was just icing on the cake.  It seems that the stars are aligning in just the right times for me to make a comeback in Thailand.
    So next post will be my preparations for the trip, and the REAL reason I am going to Thailand.
    P.S.  To new posters, yes, I am always this long-winded when it comes to my trip reports.  An example:
     

  6. Like
    Min reacted to a-447 in My long-awaited and glorious return to Thailand   
    I've always seen that Soi as the Bangkok equivalent of Pattaya's Sunee Plaza.
    Being hidden in a dark alley away from all the bright lights of the other gay areas, it is the home of hands-on sleaze. At the 3 bars before Covid it was cock everywhere you looked.
    Cum one, cum all.
  7. Haha
    Min reacted to vinapu in Cruising   
    they may be enjoying it the same way we enjoy our work with view of Thursday cheque  even if we don't like it. 
    I'm of opinion repeated  many times that straight guys are trying harder as they know they need to make good impression to stay in business. And when you take them to restaurant or store they make their choices fast.
    Once in Pattaya I went with certain Z to buy a shirt as one of mine was soiled with ink. I found one I liked , similar to soiled one , checked size and bought it , all it took was 87 seconds. His comment :   "you are not gay"
  8. Like
    Min reacted to GWMinUS in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    I just tell Guys who send me Requests that I am not an ATM...
    But then with some Friends I do have a Soft Heart... 
    ☺️
  9. Like
    Min reacted to ggobkk in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    We must accept that the boys when not entertaining us eat and drink and gossip together.  Once I traced how information spread and learned that a Vietnamese off from Screwboys knew of me from a Hot Male off as they shared the same living quarters.  I would think that your recognition level is high as you have a highly desired "good heart".
     
     
  10. Like
    Min got a reaction from BL8gPt in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    And not just boys working in the same bar. There seems to be some kind of inter-bar grapevine. The last few days, whenever I walked down the main soi in Jomtien Complex, some boys (whom I never talked to before or even saw) from different bars and massage parlors (some of which I never set foot in) said "xin chao" (or "hi" in Vietnamese) or "how's Vietnam?" There was this boy, who greeted me with "ni hao" (or "hi" Chinese) then his bar co-worker corrected him, saying something in Thai but I could hear the word "Vietnam" clearly in it  
    I don't know what type of boys you are into but I believe you will enjoy your trip
  11. Like
    Min reacted to fedssocr in 1 no-sex 1 sex questions   
    Min's tidbits includes some Cambodia info (starting in the middle of page 2)
    I did the drive from Siem Reap to Phnom Penh several years ago when Purple Dragon travel agency still existed. There's a good highway now between the two so the trip is easier than it used to be. My guide and driver were very nice but sadly since they were booked through the travel agency I don't have any sort of contact info. One of the main sights along the way is Sambor Prey Kuk. Here's a trip report I posted on Flyertalk. It was a big trip that included Bangkok, Laos and Cambodia. Post #7 has photos and some info for that part of the trip. I just stopped for an overnight along the way. I think you could do the drive in one day no problem. The place I stayed had interesting little bungalows and nice gardens. 3-4 days seems like a lot to me. You might consider taking a trip up to Preah Vihear and Koh Ker from Siem Reap for a couple of days if you haven't been there.
     
  12. Like
    Min got a reaction from TMax in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
  13. Like
    Min got a reaction from dscrtsldnbi in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (Part 4)

    To have a change of scene, I'm making a quick trip to Phnom Peng. Stayed in a centrally located hotel, close to a number of gay bars including the famous POC, Blue Chili and Heart of Darkness. My first time here so I booked a guide from Siam Roads for two night tours to gay places (tour time: 7pm to 12am, 49$ each tour).
    The night I landed, I checked Christian's list of gay massages in Cambodia (https://christianpfc.blogspot.com/2021/02/gay-massage-in-cambodia-2021.html) and found that Heco, a place highly recommended by a reader of his blog, is just 10 min walk from my hotel, so decided to pay it a visit.
     
    It's located right behind the Royal Palace. Staff speak very limited English. Just a simple question like "Can I see pictures of the boys?" took several attempts and still can't get across so I had to resort to Google translation (there was a farang, who looks like the owner, so I sought his help but turned out he doesn't speak English either). Finally staff showed me pictures of four guys on his phone and only one caught my eyes. "Sorry, he's out" (pointing outside) "Can you call him back?" Blank stare.

    After several more attempts and with help of the other boys on duty (all three of them), I finally got that it was the guy's day off and if I want him, I can come back tomorrow. Price-wise, massage here is pricy (20$ for 60min while only 10$ in other places). According to some report, masseurs expect 20$ tip for a happy ending and 30$ (if anal sex involved).
    I checked the list again and found the next nearest one is Hatha Khmer Massage in street 368 so decided to walk there. I usually prefer walking as it helps get my bearings of a new place and also complete my goal of at least 15K steps per day. When I reached the location shown on Google map half an hour later, I couldn't find the place, so I gave up and walked back to the hotel 
    Fired Blued and talked to a cute boy. He asked for money, $40 for ST. I didn't really know if it was fair, but remember the tip guidelines above so counter with $30 for an hour. He okayed it. Since the boy can't meet before 5 pm and the next day I have a tour to go to at 7 pm, we scheduled it the day after.
    The next evening, I started my first night tour at 7 pm. Guide first took me to the only night market in Phnom Peng. We walked and talked about the local life on the way. There's nothing much to see in the market, so I tried some street food (for future references: don't. Every stall sells the same kind of food, which doesn't taste good and is also pricy. Guide told me he was shocked when he saw the bill. Then why didn't he tell me in the first place?)
    Then we booked a tuk-tuk via grab (to avoid being overcharged) back to the very place I couldn't find last night: Hatha Khmer Sauna and Massage. Guide couldn't find it either (first time for him too) so he asked for directions from a local boy. We found the place (no signage and very dark). The sauna part was already closed. Guide was like: what??? (he told me sauna would open until midnight and it wasn't even 9pm at that point). We walked over to the massage part (opened until 11pm, so it was still open when I walked there yesterday, I just didn't know how to find it) and this is an interesting part.
    We were led into a dark room with a curtain. Then they opened the curtain and the scene was impressive. There were about 20 guys standing in three rows behind a glass wall, all wearing only black boxers under flattering light. Mamasan asked me to choose. Despite a large number of guys, I couldn't find anyone I like. Many are quite big with a lot of tattoos. Some do look like they just murdered some customer somewhere and then came back here to murder some more. I know a certain member in this forum would be in heaven if he were in my shoes, so I discreetly tag him @vinapu.
    Guide checked his sources and found another sauna-massage place nearby. So we walked to Love Spa just a few blocks away in Street 350 only to see that customers are leaving and the place is about to close too.

    Turned out they don't have a fixed closing time. They open at noon and would close when there are only a few customers left. Entry: 10K riels (2.5$). I asked staff what should be busy time and they said it depends. Sometimes, customers come and see that there are not so many people around so they leave. In other words,  it's busy when it's busy. Regarding masseurs, they only had two on duty and one look at them dashed all my hope for a massage with happy ending.
    We took grab tuk-tuk back to the center (it's really cheap, less than 1.5 USD each way) and stopped by HECO first. Again checked with the staff, this time the communication went smoothly as I have Guide as translator. They had 5 boys on duty today, 2 busy with customers, 3 available. Again the pictures on the phone, and again I pointed at the same guy yesterday, and again he was not in the house and I could come back the next day. I told Guide they told me exactly the same thing yesterday, and he passed the message. Turned out: to make sure he's here when I come, I need to make a booking. But I prefer to book only when I see the boy in person, so we left for Blue Chilli, about 3 min walk away.
       
    They have drag shows every Thu, Fri and Sat (closed on Sunday) at 11pm and the Cambodian mamasan (or manager/owner, I'm not sure) said their Queen troupe is the best in Cambodia. The bar was empty at that point but guy said if we come back around 10h30 pm, we would have to stand because it would be packed.
    Still early (9h30pm), I decided to move to POC nearby to check them out. Earlier, they did tap me on Grindr and their profile shows this info

    Boy shows means boys dancing in revealing clothes and currently they have only 3 coyote boys but staff told me they were not here tonight.
    So we went in. Tiny and empty, same as Blue Chilli. 

    My cocktail drink cost 4.25 USD. Guide told me all the staff here are gay and can go with customers. You buy them drink (4.5 USD, boy gets 1 USD) and talk and negotiate the price. If you want to off them, bar fine is 10 USD. Just like in Thailand. There were 4 waiters milling around, 3 in uniforms and 1 in plain white t-shirt, who looks youngest and also cutest to me.

     
    I asked Guide how much boys expect for ST and LT. He said it depends on the boy, but ST should be 40-50$ while LT should be 60-100$, then added "For me, I would charge 100$". I don't know how to interpret that last comment so I just let it pass.
    So I waived the boy in plain white shirt over and offered him a drink. He speaks limited English but I had Guide with me, so no problem. 22 years old, 1m80 and 69 kg (a bit big and heavy for my taste but cute face, sweet smile and very nice eyes), from a nearby province. He still lives with his parents and travels to work by his motorbike (45min each way). He just started working here for about a month (having another day job with Amazon), with a salary of 170$ plus tips. That also explains why he dressed differently from other waiters: he's still on probation.
    So I asked the important question: does he go with customers and he said No, he just wants to earn tips by talking to them. He got several offers since working here but always turned them down. I looked questioningly at Guide, who earlier said all the staff here are offable.
    So I sought the boy's social contact, thinking maybe it's better and more discreet if I do the negotiation via messaging. Turned out he's indeed a newbie, no Blued, Hornet or Grindr accounts, doesn't even have Line. FB and Instagram only. 

    I then tried another tactic, asking Guide to ask him why he didn't want to go with customers especially when he chooses to work in such a place. He said he doesn't want to go with local customers. I was like "I'm not Cambodian. You want to go with me?" I looked at the boy, who was embarrassed and averted his eyes and in turn looked at Guide. Guide was like "Come on!" Finally he slowly nodded, then said something in Khmer to Guide. Guide told me he said yes not just because of money but also because he likes me, so it's fifty-fifty.
    Then we moved to the part of price negotiation. He wanted me to make my offer first because he said he never had to deal with things like this before. Thinking about the last night deal, I said 40$ then Guide translated back (but I suspected he said something along that "everyone asks for 50, you should ask him for 50 too" line). So indeed the boy said he would go for 50$. Deal!
    To make sure that nothing wasn't lost in translation, I asked again if I really am his first customer. Confirmed, adding: he wasn't even sure what he's expected to do when with a customer. At that point, I had to ask if he slept with men before. Yes, got a boyfriend but already broke up, he was a bottom in that relationship. 

    The "first customer" thing reminds me of one Thai boy who worked as a waiter in the old Jupiter (when it was still at the place where Moonlight now is). I offed him from the bar and had great time. He was a newbie, just started working at Jupiter and it looked like I was his first customer, fresh and nice, did whatever I told him to do and was undemanding. Then the second time when I told him to go straight to my hotel, I could tell his behavior changed. Asked for more money, asked for taxi fares, brought me a card with some English writing (most words misspelt, including my name) :), kept asking when I would see him again. Obviously, someone told him to do all kinds of stuff to win me over and more importantly get more money. He tried, but very awkwardly  
    Back to the current situation. A group of young locals entered the bar just before show time and they all know Guide. So Guide picked the youngest and most small-built among them and literally pimped him to me as another option. I smiled and asked how much his friend wanted for ST. The expected answer: 50$.
    Then the POC show started a little late than 11pm, around the same time as the one in Blue Chilli. Since my waiter boy could only leave at the end of the show, we stayed to watch it. It was kinda meh.

    There was only one drag queen standing out to me, whom I tipped 2$ (as I saw someone tipped the performer before her 5000 riels or 1.25$).

    There was one boy dancer, who Guide said used to work with him in Toolbox before the bar closed down for good (he said Owner is back to Thailand now) and Guide appeared to pimp this one to me too. Boy is cute and I may consider if I didn't have the waiter boy first (but his dancing was all over the place, I wouldn't hire him to dance in bed).

    (to be continued)
  14. Like
    Min got a reaction from dscrtsldnbi in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    Watched a show in M2M. Again, enjoyed it very much. I also wanna see again the dancer, who blowed me away (figuratively) in the previous trip. He's still great, moving like a gayish ballet dancer with a lot of energy and oozing charm.



    Guy is obviously not the kind of twinks I'm usually into (a bit mature and a bit big). In other words, his look is not really a turn-on for me. But somehow, I can't take my eyes off him when he performs. I even picture this crazy scene: off him and watch him dance in bed for an hour
    But when he drags, the whole package looks really disturbing

    Before show, I messaged a boy asking him to come and join me in M2M, and we can go to my hotel later. He replied "I don't want to go in there". I then asked if he can go to my hotel the next day, he said "Could you change hotel. I don't like Jomtien Complex" and only agreed to meet when I explained my hotel is close to but NOT in Jomtien Complex. 
    This is the second time I saw this Jomtien-phobia thing. Right before Covid, a boy I had before (one of my memorable offs) turned down my offer for a repeat because that time I stayed in Zing. He made it very clear: If Jomtien Complex, I not go.
    Those two boys have something in common: pretty young, gay, have a regular job and only do this to earn extra money. I can't figure out why they hate Jomtien Complex (I asked but they wouldn't say). Any thoughts?
    So the next day, after an afternoon session with the boy who hates Jomtien, my boy quota for the day was met. Evening, I went to Winner Boy bar just to watch boys having fun in underwear. There were 9 boys working that night (one already got offed before I arrived) and 4 or 5 groups of customers, most of whom sat outside, only one inside with two boys. I bought drink for the first boy who approached me and we got talking. Little did I know, I got to hear his life story for the whole next hour
    He's from Bangkok, 25 years old, gay, vers top, started his MB career at Kawaii go-go bar in Boyztown when he was 17 (that means he was underaged and had to, his words, "run" whenever the police knocked on the door). His met his farang (French) boyfriend, now ex-bf, when he was 19 and the other 58, and stayed in that relationship for 4 years (show me his arm tattoo with his ex's name). It sounds like it was serious as he brought the guy home to meet the family (show me pictures of the boyfriend taken with him and his mum) and they even discussed the possibility of same-sex marriage. He didn't know why they broke up but the ex now has a new boyfriend back in France (show me pictures of a cute Caucasian teen whom I would totally off with the permission of the said boyfriend). 
    Note to self: try to find cute boys who used to have farang boyfriends because they speak good English.
    During the course of their relationship, boyfriend rented him a room, told him to quit his go-go job and also not to let other boys stay with him. But he kept working without the other knowing because, he said, some months boyfriend only sent 10K and the room alone already cost 8K (it was a nice room), he didn't have enough money left for food and other stuff so he had to work. 
    Boyfriend visited him three times each year, stayed roughly a month each. Whenever he visited, they had sex every day, sometimes 2 or 3 times a day, it was too much for him, especially because he had to bottom while prefer being a top. It looks like the boyfriend was also a bad influence on him in the way that the former drank and smoked heavily. He said he was drunk all the time whenever the French guy visited and also became a chain-smoker himself. Now he can cut down on drinking, but couldn't give up smoking despite trying.
    Then he cheated and got a Thai boyfriend, who stayed with him in the same room the French rented for him. Once they video-called and the farang got glimpse of the other boyfriend, he got jealous. Next time they video-called, he made the poor lad go around the house with his phone camera, even into the toilet, to prove that there was no one else in the house
    Then he cheated some more and got another farang supporter, who also sent him money every month until he died of Covid.
    I asked the boy if he prefers Asians and he said "sure, any time". Without taking into consideration financial support, he would go for Asian boyfriends only. 
    Anyway, back to his stories. Difficult times came with Covid. He went home to his mom for one year, then couldn't get along with her new boyfriend-cum-business-partner so he left and went back to Pattaya. Stayed in Winner Boy bar with 4 other boys for almost a year. Although his boss tried to support them as much as he could (providing accommodation, food ingredients and cookware so they can cook for themselves) and occasional customers who came to off them secretly from the closed bar, there were days he had nothing to eat or even had to pawn his cell phone to buy food. He gave a lot of credit to his boss, saying "we survived because we have a good boss".
    Now he moved out and can afford to have his own room but it's still difficult. He only had one customer in the last two weeks. The current room rent + utility bills cost 2.5K, he needs around 200 for food per day and another 100 for cigarette, so roughly 12K per month to live on.
    Back in Kawaii days, he said, he earned a lot of easy moneys, many days with two offs and customers were often more generous than the 1500ST/2500LT standard rate (now, he's willing to go ST for just 1000). He said he spent all that money on visiting karaoke host bars often having as many as 4 or 5 boys sit with him in one session (he's gay after all). 
    So it's that funny cycle: he spent money from people who liked him on boys he liked, he used the support from his farang boyfriend to support his Thai boyfriend. His farang boyfriend f*cked him who in turns f*cked his Thai boyfriend (the so-called boy-on-boy-on-boy arrangement). 
    I noticed that he talked about cheating quite nonchalantly like it was just the way of life, a fair exchange, not something morally wrong or shameful. This is the first time I digged into a Thai MB's complicated relationships with multiple partners-cum-supporters, so I don't know if this also speaks for others.
    He concluded his story, saying with regret: I used to have a lot of money, but I didn't save. Now I learned how to save but I don't have much anymore.
    It was 10.30 pm when I left. The bar was empty of customers except for one blond-haired farang sitting in a corner with a new boy who just showed up for work today (24 years old, nice ass, very sexy and revealing undies). They did something quietly for more than an hour, ordering several rounds of drinks and the boy later took a large tower to cover certain parts of his body (under-the-table activities under way I presume). Most boys also left (probably no hope for more customers to come). The only waiter (a chubby Thai with highlighted hairs in his mid-30s) nodded off in another corner. Boy told me he's the owner's boyfriend (who's 61, sitting outside with the only remaining boy) and they have been together for 13 years.
    My soft drink was 90, boy drink was 150. I gave the boy 500 for his time. I would see him again for other activities. The boy has good genes. Despite everything he had been through, smoking, drinking, Covid and all, still look quite boyish with a lean, supple body. To a Westerner, he may look like he's still in high school who took to wearing underwear as his uniform.
  15. Like
    Min got a reaction from Boy69 in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
  16. Like
    Min got a reaction from BL8gPt in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    He's also at disadvantage because he's foreigner and not legally allowed to work, so can't ask for the same pay as Thai.

    Anyway, I talked to a new Thai waiter at Panorama (Pattaya) last night, who just started 4 days ago. He got paid between 4000 and 6000 per month for a shift starting from 4pm until 1 or 2 am in the morning. So my 200 tip for him is already more than his whole day's pay check. I guess they must rely on tips to survive.
    Still, just a few are actually gay
  17. Like
    Min got a reaction from a-447 in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
  18. Like
    Min got a reaction from Ruthrieston in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
  19. Like
    Min got a reaction from 1moRussian in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 8 )
    Back in Hanoi, I encountered a similar problem with a newly opened gay massage parlor a few years ago. The owner also applied a rotation system to make sure his masseurs all have customers, so he told me I was not allowed to pick. When I turned around to leave, he immediately gave in "ok, you can choose."
    So I marched into the M star shop around 8h30 pm (not sure if it's peak time though), trying to look aggressive (and failing completely). I prefaced my request with "My friend said that you guys don't allow customers to choose masseur, but..."
    The masseur standing at the door cut in before I finished my sentence "You can, you can". Just like that. I had expected a fight!
    So @flashbarryallen just be assertive if you need to.
    Guy at the door also told me the minimum tip for normal no-sex massage is 100. Any extra services, I should discuss with the guy once we are in the room.
    So I picked my boyish masseur, who's 27, paid 500B for 1-hour aroma oil massage and proceeded to the fourth floor for my session. Once inside the room, I started price discussion right away, as I usually do, to make sure no problems or misunderstanding at the end.
    Unfortunately, the kid's English was extremely limited so after a while, mostly with help of Google translation, I figured that minimum tip for no-sex massage is 200 (not consistent with what Guy at the door told me). If I want him to take off his clothes while providing the service so I can touch, that would be 1000. If I want to suck his dick, that would be 1500. He's man, so he wouldn't do anything else.
    1500? I repeated and just looked at him. He quickly lowered his asking price 1300 ok? I do saloh saloh massage ok?
    What the hell does "saloh saloh" mean?
    I asked him in a more polite language. He tried to explain in vain, then kept saying sorry for his limited English.
    Looking the kid's very agitated face (he was obviously uncomfortable with haggling), I kinda felt bad so I didn't bother with further negotiation. If it means that much to him.
    The massage turned out to be much better than I expected. Kid had good techniques, his touch was quite sensual and one hour flied by quickly. The only thing that irked me a bit is that he kept saying "saloh saloh" during the whole session and I still couldn't figure out what he meant.
    Anyway, satisfied, I gave Kid 1500 and he bent over so low (almost to a kneeling position) to thank me, like I were Royalty or something. If only he bent over like that during the session I might have doubled my tip. 
    When I walked down the stairs to the ground floor, he led the way and again kept saying "saloh saloh" and I finally got it. He meant "slow, slow," (take your time).
    The next day, I started my evening in Banana Room outside. Bought a drink for one host who spoke decent English (again, he used to have an American boyfriend for about a year so no surprises here) and got some intel.
    Banana Room actually has three bars. Downstairs, the outside bar serves as a beer bar (my soft drink 80B, in line with other bars in the soi), the inside bar - as a go-go (when I moved inside I had to buy a new drink at 350B). The bars downstairs close at midnight, at which they start the upstairs one that stays open until 4 am. Host showed me videos of the upstairs bar. It was pretty roomy and packed with customers, DJ station-level packed. Looks like this is the cash cow for Banana Room (owner is straight Thai with a wife) as I didn't much activities in both bars downstairs during my last two visits.
    So outside downstairs, they currently have 4 hosts (3 from Laos and 1 from Myanmar, 3 gays and 1 straight). Unfortunately the cutest one, a Laotian, that I would off is straight. He had a girlfriend and wasn't allowed (by his girlfriend?) to go with customers, Host told me.
    But in my previous visit, I saw that boy in underwear standing on the stage inside as a go-go boy. Sometimes, when there were too few boys inside, boss would ask him to double as a go-go so the stage would look less empty. Host explained. So does he go with customers when he's inside? Nobody knows. Or, probably, everyone knows but his girlfriend doesn't.
    Inside downstairs, they have around 10 go-go staff. Host admitted that they didn't have the strongest cast in the soi and some boys never had any customers since they worked there. Then why they kept coming back? Because boss paid each 200 per night just for showing up.
    Host said he himself gets paid 8000 per month and for that salary, he starts his work at 3 pm, serving in the outside downstairs bar until mid night, then moving upstairs to continue working as bartender until 4am. That means 14 hours a day for 8000 a month. It doesn't seem fair even though he can stay for free in the bar.
    He said he went to bed at 6am and when he wakes up, it's time to start his work again. That grueling schedule also means he can go with customers on his off days only. He also earned tips from the bartender gig, but usually just around 100-120B per night. That was enough to cover his food expenses.
    This trip, I finally come to terms with the fact that it's much harder for me to find cute twinks who can bottom in Bangkok bars than in Pattaya. I think some members in this board also draw the same conclusions (app is a different story though).
    Most boys of my type in Bangkok go-gos turned out straight. Out of two dozen boys currently in Fresh Boys, only 5, according to a mamasan, who rattled off their numbers and I duly took note (No 1, 8, 14, 24 and 29) are gay and can do anything. But I like number 26 and 28, both of whom aren't willing to do much. Not even kissing or sucking, which wouldn't do for a top like me.
    My last day in Bangkok before returning to Pattaya, where I usually stay for much longer, I decided to revisit Dream Boy. Mamasan, who helped me with offing a boy last time (no 75, very cute, but straight and dud in bed) and got tipped accordingly, was very happy to see me. "We have some new boys you can have a look". Another mamasan, who had seen me on and off the soil for the whole last month, said "You never go home?" Actually I did but I came back.
    So I sat down, and Mamasan pointed out the new ones (they currently have between 30 and 40 boys, the most of any Bangkok go-gos, I guess). No 26 immediately caught my eyes. I also like No 45. I asked mamasan what No 26 is willing to do. He wasn't sure so he scampered off to ask, then came back with a big smile: he's gay and can do anything.
    I asked for Boy to sit with me. 22, fresh from Chiang Mai, just been here for a week. 3 customers so far, not bad for one week (then he added: including you - good, he already counted me as a customer). He also advertised on Hornet but no catch yet. I asked to see his Hornet's pictures and I think I can see why: the camera must hate the kid. In fact, I saw his pictures a couple of times before but didn't think much of it. Even his body looks worse in those. In person, he got my attention right off the bat with that toned body, boyish face and that little shy smile.
    I told him: you should change your pictures. Take a picture with smiles. You have a nice smile, show it so customers would find you more attractive (gosh I sound like a pimp). 
    I later checked his Hornet again, kid did change his pictures but still no smiling ones.
    Since he's gay and versatile (he told me he and his ex-bf back in Chiang Mai took turns to top each other), I asked him which boys currently on stage he would pick. If he also picks No 45, I don't know what I would do (maybe the obvious - as my professor in orgy-ology @vinapu would say). But he picked no 24. Damned, so no threesome this time (my other professor in modesty @reader would feel so relieved).
    So like the Phnom Peng trip (reported in parts 5 to 7), my Bangkok trip also ended in a decent note. It looks like I finally had some luck with offing boys from bar. I would rank it my third best on this trip. The other two were from the apps.
    My second best is an 19 years old boy from Isan, in Bangkok to study (he told me). He used to work part-time in a restaurant, lost his job due to Covid, never worked in a boy bar before. We chatted on Grindr, he seems nice and very accommodating, answering all the questions without attitude. Asked for 2000 then agreed with 1500. So I told him to come to my hotel. I didn't know that at that point jason1975 was doing more or less the same thing, in the same hotel (just different floor). I got lazy so I copied his narration
    Anyway, I could tell that the boy was really into me. He was all over me the moment I closed the door. He kept giggling and holding my face with both hands, saying "you are nice". After sex, we cuddled a little and a couple of times I tried to get up (it was time for me to hit the gym), he held me back for a few more minutes. When I gave him the money (the agreed amount + 200B for travel), he said in his broken English: "I like you but not as customer" hehe, so we are like brothers with benefits now? 
    My best is a boy, also from Chiang Mai, who stopped in Bangkok just for one night on his way home. He stayed in Quarter in Soil 6 a few hundreds meters from my own hotel, so we kinda "ran into" each other on Hornet. He only asked for 1000 so there was no haggling. Since he's so close, I asked to meet him in person and he, not just met, but took me directly to his room. I didn't expect this, nor did I expect the sex would be so... inspiring in a so tiny room It all happened less than 30 min from the point we started chatting.
    I asked him when he would leave Bangkok, thinking for an immediate repeat the next day (I rarely do this) but he said he will fly out early the next morning. Since he said the Quarter room cost him 1500, I gave him all the pocket money I had on me at that point (1800B). I walked from my hotel to his in my shorts, sleeveless T-shirt, slippers, bringing no wallet, condoms or lubes, thinking I would just see if he really looks like his picture
    (to be continued)
  20. Like
    Min got a reaction from vinapu in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
  21. Like
    Min reacted to Londoner in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    I am led to believe that the guys on the scene  prefer Asian customers because they pay better; particularly the Japanese.
    I'm disappointed to read  the comments about falangs. One of the things that impressed me on my first visit in the late 90s was that, as far I could see, the punters (who in those days were overwhelmingly European and American) seemed to treat the guys well. And this was confirmed by  Thais when I got to know them better on later visits.
    What a pity if things have changed. I wonder if the fact that many of us had lived our younger days in an atmosphere of repression back home made us more appreciative of our new Thai friends? Perhaps later visitors took them and the opportunities they offered for granted. 
  22. Like
    Min got a reaction from moistmango in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 8 )
    Back in Hanoi, I encountered a similar problem with a newly opened gay massage parlor a few years ago. The owner also applied a rotation system to make sure his masseurs all have customers, so he told me I was not allowed to pick. When I turned around to leave, he immediately gave in "ok, you can choose."
    So I marched into the M star shop around 8h30 pm (not sure if it's peak time though), trying to look aggressive (and failing completely). I prefaced my request with "My friend said that you guys don't allow customers to choose masseur, but..."
    The masseur standing at the door cut in before I finished my sentence "You can, you can". Just like that. I had expected a fight!
    So @flashbarryallen just be assertive if you need to.
    Guy at the door also told me the minimum tip for normal no-sex massage is 100. Any extra services, I should discuss with the guy once we are in the room.
    So I picked my boyish masseur, who's 27, paid 500B for 1-hour aroma oil massage and proceeded to the fourth floor for my session. Once inside the room, I started price discussion right away, as I usually do, to make sure no problems or misunderstanding at the end.
    Unfortunately, the kid's English was extremely limited so after a while, mostly with help of Google translation, I figured that minimum tip for no-sex massage is 200 (not consistent with what Guy at the door told me). If I want him to take off his clothes while providing the service so I can touch, that would be 1000. If I want to suck his dick, that would be 1500. He's man, so he wouldn't do anything else.
    1500? I repeated and just looked at him. He quickly lowered his asking price 1300 ok? I do saloh saloh massage ok?
    What the hell does "saloh saloh" mean?
    I asked him in a more polite language. He tried to explain in vain, then kept saying sorry for his limited English.
    Looking the kid's very agitated face (he was obviously uncomfortable with haggling), I kinda felt bad so I didn't bother with further negotiation. If it means that much to him.
    The massage turned out to be much better than I expected. Kid had good techniques, his touch was quite sensual and one hour flied by quickly. The only thing that irked me a bit is that he kept saying "saloh saloh" during the whole session and I still couldn't figure out what he meant.
    Anyway, satisfied, I gave Kid 1500 and he bent over so low (almost to a kneeling position) to thank me, like I were Royalty or something. If only he bent over like that during the session I might have doubled my tip. 
    When I walked down the stairs to the ground floor, he led the way and again kept saying "saloh saloh" and I finally got it. He meant "slow, slow," (take your time).
    The next day, I started my evening in Banana Room outside. Bought a drink for one host who spoke decent English (again, he used to have an American boyfriend for about a year so no surprises here) and got some intel.
    Banana Room actually has three bars. Downstairs, the outside bar serves as a beer bar (my soft drink 80B, in line with other bars in the soi), the inside bar - as a go-go (when I moved inside I had to buy a new drink at 350B). The bars downstairs close at midnight, at which they start the upstairs one that stays open until 4 am. Host showed me videos of the upstairs bar. It was pretty roomy and packed with customers, DJ station-level packed. Looks like this is the cash cow for Banana Room (owner is straight Thai with a wife) as I didn't much activities in both bars downstairs during my last two visits.
    So outside downstairs, they currently have 4 hosts (3 from Laos and 1 from Myanmar, 3 gays and 1 straight). Unfortunately the cutest one, a Laotian, that I would off is straight. He had a girlfriend and wasn't allowed (by his girlfriend?) to go with customers, Host told me.
    But in my previous visit, I saw that boy in underwear standing on the stage inside as a go-go boy. Sometimes, when there were too few boys inside, boss would ask him to double as a go-go so the stage would look less empty. Host explained. So does he go with customers when he's inside? Nobody knows. Or, probably, everyone knows but his girlfriend doesn't.
    Inside downstairs, they have around 10 go-go staff. Host admitted that they didn't have the strongest cast in the soi and some boys never had any customers since they worked there. Then why they kept coming back? Because boss paid each 200 per night just for showing up.
    Host said he himself gets paid 8000 per month and for that salary, he starts his work at 3 pm, serving in the outside downstairs bar until mid night, then moving upstairs to continue working as bartender until 4am. That means 14 hours a day for 8000 a month. It doesn't seem fair even though he can stay for free in the bar.
    He said he went to bed at 6am and when he wakes up, it's time to start his work again. That grueling schedule also means he can go with customers on his off days only. He also earned tips from the bartender gig, but usually just around 100-120B per night. That was enough to cover his food expenses.
    This trip, I finally come to terms with the fact that it's much harder for me to find cute twinks who can bottom in Bangkok bars than in Pattaya. I think some members in this board also draw the same conclusions (app is a different story though).
    Most boys of my type in Bangkok go-gos turned out straight. Out of two dozen boys currently in Fresh Boys, only 5, according to a mamasan, who rattled off their numbers and I duly took note (No 1, 8, 14, 24 and 29) are gay and can do anything. But I like number 26 and 28, both of whom aren't willing to do much. Not even kissing or sucking, which wouldn't do for a top like me.
    My last day in Bangkok before returning to Pattaya, where I usually stay for much longer, I decided to revisit Dream Boy. Mamasan, who helped me with offing a boy last time (no 75, very cute, but straight and dud in bed) and got tipped accordingly, was very happy to see me. "We have some new boys you can have a look". Another mamasan, who had seen me on and off the soil for the whole last month, said "You never go home?" Actually I did but I came back.
    So I sat down, and Mamasan pointed out the new ones (they currently have between 30 and 40 boys, the most of any Bangkok go-gos, I guess). No 26 immediately caught my eyes. I also like No 45. I asked mamasan what No 26 is willing to do. He wasn't sure so he scampered off to ask, then came back with a big smile: he's gay and can do anything.
    I asked for Boy to sit with me. 22, fresh from Chiang Mai, just been here for a week. 3 customers so far, not bad for one week (then he added: including you - good, he already counted me as a customer). He also advertised on Hornet but no catch yet. I asked to see his Hornet's pictures and I think I can see why: the camera must hate the kid. In fact, I saw his pictures a couple of times before but didn't think much of it. Even his body looks worse in those. In person, he got my attention right off the bat with that toned body, boyish face and that little shy smile.
    I told him: you should change your pictures. Take a picture with smiles. You have a nice smile, show it so customers would find you more attractive (gosh I sound like a pimp). 
    I later checked his Hornet again, kid did change his pictures but still no smiling ones.
    Since he's gay and versatile (he told me he and his ex-bf back in Chiang Mai took turns to top each other), I asked him which boys currently on stage he would pick. If he also picks No 45, I don't know what I would do (maybe the obvious - as my professor in orgy-ology @vinapu would say). But he picked no 24. Damned, so no threesome this time (my other professor in modesty @reader would feel so relieved).
    So like the Phnom Peng trip (reported in parts 5 to 7), my Bangkok trip also ended in a decent note. It looks like I finally had some luck with offing boys from bar. I would rank it my third best on this trip. The other two were from the apps.
    My second best is an 19 years old boy from Isan, in Bangkok to study (he told me). He used to work part-time in a restaurant, lost his job due to Covid, never worked in a boy bar before. We chatted on Grindr, he seems nice and very accommodating, answering all the questions without attitude. Asked for 2000 then agreed with 1500. So I told him to come to my hotel. I didn't know that at that point jason1975 was doing more or less the same thing, in the same hotel (just different floor). I got lazy so I copied his narration
    Anyway, I could tell that the boy was really into me. He was all over me the moment I closed the door. He kept giggling and holding my face with both hands, saying "you are nice". After sex, we cuddled a little and a couple of times I tried to get up (it was time for me to hit the gym), he held me back for a few more minutes. When I gave him the money (the agreed amount + 200B for travel), he said in his broken English: "I like you but not as customer" hehe, so we are like brothers with benefits now? 
    My best is a boy, also from Chiang Mai, who stopped in Bangkok just for one night on his way home. He stayed in Quarter in Soil 6 a few hundreds meters from my own hotel, so we kinda "ran into" each other on Hornet. He only asked for 1000 so there was no haggling. Since he's so close, I asked to meet him in person and he, not just met, but took me directly to his room. I didn't expect this, nor did I expect the sex would be so... inspiring in a so tiny room It all happened less than 30 min from the point we started chatting.
    I asked him when he would leave Bangkok, thinking for an immediate repeat the next day (I rarely do this) but he said he will fly out early the next morning. Since he said the Quarter room cost him 1500, I gave him all the pocket money I had on me at that point (1800B). I walked from my hotel to his in my shorts, sleeveless T-shirt, slippers, bringing no wallet, condoms or lubes, thinking I would just see if he really looks like his picture
    (to be continued)
  23. Like
    Min got a reaction from CurtisD in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
  24. Like
    Min got a reaction from Lonnie in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
  25. Like
    Min got a reaction from fedssocr in Min's tidbits about my Thailand and Vietnam experiences   
    (part 9)
    During my 7-day stay in Boyztown this time, I had another massage session with Kiwi. It seems he had more customers recently (asked me to re-schedule twice because of schedule conflicts).
    The second time, he had to go to Bowin (more than 30 km from Pattaya) in the evening to meet a Chinese customer, who's working in some construction project there, and stayed overnight. The next morning, I checked if he's back yet. "Not yet, I'm still cleaning"? Cleaning? I thought he went there for massage services. Turned out Customer gave him 3000 for massage + staying overnight and 1000 for 2-way Grab fare. After massage, it took customer less than 2 minutes to cum. Kiwi felt bad for customer, spending all that money for those 2 minutes (he's must be a result-oriented person), so he offered to stay and clean customer's whole house before he left.
    Back in my room, this time he brought candles to make it, his words, "special and romantic". Wonder if anyone told him about my previous review (reported in part 1, in which I did say he brought everything but no candles).

    As usual, he talked a lot during our session and I just listened to his stories, some of which were nice and warm (like what his Chinese ex did for him), some bizarre but exciting (like that time a Japanese customer hired him and 6 other MBs in Bangkok, and paid very good money, 6K each, for an orgy; but he couldn't get hard probably due to peer pressure and became the only bottom everyone else took turns to top), and some, unfortunately, saddening. 
    Contrary to popular belief, many farang customers were not civil, generous, or even hygienic. Some were outright rude. 
    One asked him to do foot massage, then Thai massage then oil massage, which took 4 hours in total. Then on top of that, he was asked to f*ck the customer for another half an hour (it was so hard because he had no energy left but he soldiered on), and got paid 1500 for all these. 
    Or when he bent down to rub some customers' genitals, he had to hold his breath because it looked like that part hadn't been washed in a long time. 
    Or this farang (who looked old, all wrinkled and overweight in his pictures) contacted him on app for a possible meeting. When being told he has to pay, the old guy said this "Your parents must be proud when they find out that you are a money boy", then boasted about how he himself could have other Thais, who are students, younger and cuter, for free.
    "I don't believe him. And my parents do know about my work." Kiwi said.
    I guess, we all had some very hard days.
    Having moved to Zing in Jomtien Complex, I first stopped by the new B.N. bar just opened last month, 10 June to be exact. It's a few meters from The Venue, a bit off the main soi, so the location is not at all ideal (the only advantage is that it's a lot quieter here so easier to talk). Bought drinks for and talked to their new Cambodian boy (just here for a week) and also a cute skinny Thai I always saw sitting outside every time I walked by. It turns out the Thai not just a boy, he's actually the co-owner of this new bar!
    27 years old, used to work in 2 go-go bars in the now-defunct Twilight soi in Bangkok, then Toy Boy in Boyztown, Pattaya right before Covid. And now, he opened a beer bar with his best friend, a Cambodian guy who looks around his age (B.N. is the initials of his name - Bass and that of the partner - Nut, if I got it right. I saw someone already interpreted the acronym as Big Nuts hehe). 
    I forgot to take pictures last night so I just use an old picture from Internet. I'll come back later tonight to get a more current picture of the bar.

    Each partner put in half the investment (400K for fixed assets and an extra 50K for liquors and beverages). Even if the location is not prime, they still have to pay the same rent rate as everybody else in the main soi: 20K per month for their small shop, utilities adding another 3K, and, well, 2.5K to the local police (every bar in the soi pays more or less that amount, the owner told me) so they would turn a blind eye to things like non-Thai staff and late opening hours.
    For now, with that overhead, there's no way they can make a profit. They are trying to hold out and wait for the high season (or when the Chinese are allowed to come back), said the owner, who thought I'm Singaporean and who used to have a lot of Asian customers, mostly Chinese and Japanese, back in his go-go days.
    The two hours I sat there, they had only 3 customers. While the Thai partner was talking to me, the Cambodian one sat listening patiently to an elderly farang, who talked slowly but incessantly for a good two hours. "Is your partner's English that good?" The Thai shaked his head "same same me, but the customer can speak Thai".
    Apart from two partners slash host, they have 3 other hosts (2 Cambodians and 1 Lao). @gerefan, I read your comment so I asked them again about the basic salary. The new Cambodian host told me they received 100B from the bar but only for any night they don't have any customers (drinks or off) - so that means 3000 minimum per month (3 hosts there share an upstairs room in the Complex for about 4000).
    Some customers wanted to off the Thai owner himself, but he couldn't go because he's been playing multiple roles at the bar (owner slash host slash cashier slash bartender slash legal representative when the police come - the bar registered under his name and it looks like his Cambodian buddy is a silent partner) and no one so far would wait until the bar closes to take him.
    Another piece of intel: one of the bar's Cambodians, who the other day talked to Dough, the owner of Toolbox bar in Phnom Peng (mentioned in Part 7), pointed at some space near Agate's entrance and told me, Dough's new bar is gonna be there. 
    On a separate note, a Thai boy from X-boys asked me to take him to watch a show in another bar because he said he never got to see any show in his life (sound like a sob story to me). Since I already moved to Jomtien, I told him to take a day off from his Boyztown bar and come to Jomtien complex, I'll take him to drink and watch a show in M2M and then we can go to my hotel. He said he can't take a day off as he has to report to work in the bar every day even if he's sick. In the case of no-show, he has to pay bar fine of 500 per day. I guess I can give him that money too, but just wonder about the situation.
    A Lao boy from Boyz Boyz Boyz told me something similar. If a customer can't go to the bar to pick him up, he could only go before or after working hours (8pm to 2am) if he wants to avoid the bar fine.
    On the other hand, I also see on many occasions boys in Fresh Boys and Dream Boy in Bangkok, and Winner Boy, Toy Boy and Pikky in Pattaya, didn't show up for work for all kinds of reason or while being at work, they just left to eat or went home early when there's no hope for more customers. 
    The Thai boy (mentioned in part 2) told me he used to juggle two jobs with both Winner Boy in Sunee and Pikky in Boyztown. So usually weekdays, he worked in Winner Boy, and in weekends, when Boyztown was busier, he switched to Pikky.
    Last time, I had to wait for an hour for a boy in Fresh Boys and he didn't show up. Mamasan told me, probably because of the heavy rain that night, while a Viet waiter told me he thought the boy just had an outside customer.
    Last week, I went to Winner Boy bar twice and on both occasions had to leave because the owner who was sitting outside with one or two fully clothed boys told me they didn't have enough boys coming to work so they couldn't open the bar inside.
    So it looks to me, some bars are more strict about enforcing bar fines than others to make sure that boys can't take outside customers during their working hours without generating some kind of revenue for the bar.
    (to be continued)
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