Bob

Interesting comment, cat. It's okay for you to lie as long as you're horny? Or it's okay for you to promise something and then withdraw the promise later? No wonder your bf has the attitude he does.

You're right, Ilz. I have a photo of the bar next to the Wangcome somewhere but can't find it at the moment. I recall it had a medium-sized sign at the time which read: BOY BAR. There wasn't any question what it was....

You know, I don't remember, PM; however, looking at my passport when I went into Burma on the day pass one time, I notice the following: 1) I first arrived in Thailand on February 1 and I see that visa stamp (admitted to March 2nd); 2) I see a "Departed" stamp on February 8th issued by Thai immigration in Mae Sai; 3) There's the Myanmar entry and exit stamps dated February 8th; and 4) I see a new entry stamp for Thailand that's dated February 8th (admitted to March 9th). So, the answer is yes. Now I'm wondering if I paid the damn 500 baht exit fee or if that only applies at the airport......sorry, don't recall. Maybe Pete knows.

I usually stay at the Wangcome Hotel in Chiangrai. It's above the average in town, costs about 1200-1300 baht per night, has a very good buffet breakfast, and, best of all, is within walking distance to everything. The Lobo boy bar mentioned by Pete is immediately across the street from the north side of the hotel. And the night market is about a 2 block walk from the Wangcome. On one trip, I decided to splurge and stayed at the Dusit Hotel on Dusit Island (an island formed by the Kok River and tributaries at the very north end of town). Extremely nice place and the only drawback is that it isn't close to anything (and too far to walk to the two boybars or the night market). Here are a few photos (the last being a view from the room of the Kok River).

With respect to other side-trips from Chiangrai, Pete mentions the border crossing into Burma (Myanmar). Many tourists go there and are allowed a day pass (a one-day visa as I think you must get a visa beforehand to stay in Burma any longer) and, if I recall right, the cost was $5.00 (although I think I read recently that the amount was raised to possibly $7.00). Lots of shopping within the small Burmese city across the bridge with many items quite different from the standard nightmarket stuff (junk?) usually found in Thailand. I have purchased a couple of nice wood carvings up there. As to photos, the first one shows the bridge going across. Second shows the city center. Third, one of my favorities, shows three buddhist monk pals strolling through the shopping district.

Sorry, can't figure out how to attach and then continue with writing. So will do these separately I guess. Doi Tung. As noted, the Doi Tung chalet, museum, and gardens are about 30 miles north of Chiangrai (best to rent a car for the trip there...and plan on about 4 hours for the whole trip). The King's mother, along with the present King, lived many years in Switzerland following the military coup in Thailand in 1932. She loved the swiss architecture and so, to honor her, the present King (with the government, perhaps) built the large chalet-style residence and museum at Doi Tung (which means "flag mountain"). The museum part of the chalet honors the Princess Mother who died in 1995 can has a fair number of video presentations of her work and passion for the hilltribe people and some agricultural processes. The gardens are not large, maybe 10 acres or so, but are rather beautiful. As concerns the "wedding cake" temple (Wat Rawng Koon), you really need to see it (the outside is the speciality whereas the inner part of the temple is rather plain and unremarkable). Here are a couple more photos. Note in the first photo the cement sculptures below and to the left and right of the elephant tusks. The second photo is a closeup of one of those areas. Rather bizzare stuff.

Edit: Well, guess the photos did attach. Anyway, first one is of the city watchtower, somewhat in the center of the business district. Second photo is a statue and small park at the north end of Chiangrai (if my memory is correct - don't bet on it - it's King Mengrai). Third photo is a shot of one of the many nice temples in Chiangrai. There's one nice temple in Chiangrai which has a few ponds with hundreds of turtles, some rather large, and is worth a visit for those interested (unfortunately, can't find those photos at the moment).

I too have visited the Chiangrai area a few times and really enjoy the laid-back atmosphere. I can echo many of the comments Pete has made. Like Pete, I really enjoyed seeing Doi Tung, the Chalet/Garden for the Princess Mother (I think that's what they call her, she's was the current king's mother). Beautiful place about a 45 minute drive north/northeast of Chiangrai.. Unfortunately, rains a lot up in that mountainous area and it's rained both times I've been up there. Would love to see it in the early morning sun. Here's a photo I took in 2004: [attachmentid=21] I also was fascinated with the "wedding cake temple". Have only been there once (if I recall, it's about 4-5 miles south of Chiangrai?) and it wasn't finished. Here's a 2004 photo of that: [attachmentid=22] (I can post a few more photos of some of the things mentioned by Pete but am worried I'm using up too much bandwidth here. Let me know if you think otherwise, GB, GT, Stef, or whoever).

Hmmm........am going to have to check this place out when I get there in a month. Think that's the first barspace at the congregation of bars immediately west of the soi next to the D2 hotel. If I recall right, was a lady bar last year.

GT: My only question is about the thai experts that accompanied you. Well, were they cute?

Teepee: Not trying to be difficult here but you but I'm not really sure what "visa free" means other than you don't have to get a visa prior to entering the country. I thought a visa was permission to enter a country and is evidenced by a stamp/endorsement on one's passport. The 30-day "visa" , I would think, is just a visa given after entry to certain country's citizens. Calling it a "visa free" situation seems to be erroneous wordsmith. If it was truly "visa free", I wouldn't need the permission or the stamp I would think. On the other hand, I can understand the new policy is intended to stop the "30-day" people from essentially staying forever. But, unless the Thai authorities plan on investigating longer-term visas applicants than the "30-dayers" that show up at the airport, I don't see the point of all of it.

Thaiquila: "Are you implying that pedophilia is acceptable if it is contracted through a go-go bar? You seem to feel very strongly about this. I wonder why?" What a stupid and insulting comment. "Cutely" implying somebody is a pedophile without any factual basis says more about you. And, for the record (presuming you can read), no, he didn't say that. Unless one is blind, it's obvious that there is an underaged problem in the Sunnee area but, based on my observations, the vast majority of bars there only have legal-aged staff. And even the Boyztown bars aren't immune from the problem (I checked one ID and the gogo bar worker was 16) although it's a pretty rare issue there based on my observations.

While I'm no fan of Shinawatra, I am even less of a fan of any group of alleged intellectuals who make any attempt to "save" a country by employing non-democratic methods. The whole point of a democracy is that a majority get to elect the leader and the snobby intellectuals, rather than respecting the choice of the majority, end up undermining the whole system. It's not much different than the generals staging a coup because they don't like how things are going. What is amazing all the more is the situation in Thailand where Thai Rak Thai garnered an unprecedented 70% of the vote. But, as you say, the vote was largely the rural folk and poor folk and the alleged intelligentia didn't support him. If Thaksin is breaking the law, deal with it in the Court as that's the system. Or advocate a meritorious position, find a semi-intelligent leader, and have the balls to try to beat him at the ballotbox (boycotting the election when you know you're going to get your butt thrashed is stupd and, arguably, undemocratic). Thaksin may or may not be corrupt but Sondhi and his cadre are elitist snobs in my opinion. (Not that it should surprise anybody, but Sondhi - the leader of the group that marched in Bangkok and demanded resignations, etc. - is neither a hero or a populist but just happens to be a bitter business rival of Shinawatra. Sondhi is supposedly the second richest guy in Thailand. I wouldn't want him "saving" me from anyone).

Although I know there are some good cops and good prosecutors out there, this case was extremely stupid from the beginning. The guy was obviously a nut case. What was incredible is that they arrested him based on his comments (that he was with the kid when she died but it was an accident and that he had sex with her) which they prosecutor knew were false statements.. Given the condition of the body (8 inch crack in her skull and garrot around her neck), saying the death was an "accident" is almost insane at its core. What was further dumbfounding - and grossly negligent at best - was the fact that the ex-wife [who hated the guy with a passion but nevertheless was certain that he was with her on Christmas Day (seems natural to me that somebody might remember if their spouse wasn't with them on Christmas!)] was never contacted by the Boulder police or prosecutor even after she tried to contact them (her attorney, the same guy who represents Barry Bonds the ballplayer, publicly lamented on the news that the Boulder DA wouldn't return his calls)! The modern day definition of a criminal is somebody who is so dumb that even a detective can catch him. In some cases, I think you can use the word "prosecutor" instead of "detective."

I'll check it out when I'm there in October. AA has most definitely been the most-closed bar in Chiangmai, averaging 1-2 times a year by the boys in brown due to the shows. I was told it was closed permanently a couple of those times but it was open again a month later. Maybe not this time.

I presume you're not referring to me as one of the "known suspects" or "hydras." You've known me a little from the other board and hopefully you know I don't fit that profile. Yet, I stand by my remarks. You're correct in that I don't know the former Topman guy; however, other people do. And to make a statement about his stealing from his former employer - especially where you acknowledge your information is based on something you heard - is simply atrocious.

"I think he was caught with his hand in the till" I have no intention of personally attacking anyone or joining the obvious "anti-LTMU" crusade one or two others seem to carry on; however, responding about idiotic comments is fair game in my opinion. Here we have Mr. Alleged Insider saying he thinks the guy embezzled. If it's true, what's the point of posting that bit of information on a board like this? If it's not true ( "I think ..."), then it's only worse. I don't believe there was much "thinking" going on when the statement was posted and the statement ought to be removed.

Not sure what your point is, LTMU, but you're free to leave if you don't like it. I appreciate the articles because, even though I do read some of the same newspapers, I often don't key in on some of the topics that GB highlights. You're certainly free to ignore anybody's postings. Hell, I've gotten used to exercising that right as have many others.

Sounds like a question about the level of risk one wishes to undertake (there's no question about the law as GB pointed out). Based upon what I've known a couple of times but more based on what I've consistently heard, the thai authorities don't usually look the other way when a falang is caught working without a work permit. I wouldn't risk losing my right to stay or return to Thailand for this.....but, hey, I wouldn't drive a motorcycle from Bangkok to Pattaya either....

For all of those connecting on international and domestic flights for the last two weeks of September, I feel sorry for you (I wonder how long it takes to travel between the two airports?). I'm glad I don't arrive until October.

Jesus, Hedda, give it a rest. Up until your post, I thought this thread was about a great story about the honors given to GP. Presuming you just can't help yourself and are somehow driven to get in some digs about Smiles or the Sawatdee formum, it would have been nice if you would have done that elsewhere. P.S. I believe there are approximately 27 aborigines, 34 bedouins, and 19 Japanese soldiers in caves (who still think the war isn't over) that actually haven't heard of your views about the hydras, the other forum, and Smiles. Perhaps a news leaflet drop from an airplane might be more useful to notify those people of your views rather than postings them here as that would at least spare the other 4 billion people on the planet from hearing about it hundreds of times.

Nice report, GB. And wish I could have been there to help honor Allen.

I don't have a clue about the sex toys but I'm not about to experiment (I really don't want the customs officer holding up a dildo asking me (in front of 50 other people) if it's mine! Last summer, to visit a friend who was suddenly hospitalized in another city, I obtained a one-way airline ticket to go visit and also took with me a carry-on bag of clothes for my friend's wife which her mother packed. Unfortunately, I was the target - single male with a one-way ticket and was pulled out of line for special searching by security. I tried to use a little humor (when some ugly dude was patting me down and heading south of my belt, I asked if I could request a female officer for review of my southern zones) but that got me nowhere (I think humor requires a minimal IQ of 65 or thereabouts). When another unpleasant fellow bellowed out "are these clothes yours?!?", I answered (without thinking) "yes." Well, the dumbass at that point held up a rather funny looking pair of pink panties for all the world to see and it was at that time I unsuccessfully tried to become invisible. Of course, that wasn't the end of it. I tried to explain the real deal and all I got was a stupid look and the inquiry as to whether I was carrying a bag I didn't pack. I almost missed the plane which left an hour later.....

Okay, enough already.....let's just drop the subject. As to "Rose" comments that only lunatics would post with their real names, I totally disagree. If we used our real names and didn't hide behind the anomimity (if I spelled that right!) of the net, perhaps more people would behave like adults. But, given I've always used my first name on all of the relevant boards, perhaps I'm half an idiot.

All of the "hydra" talk from day one has been repetitive, boring, and paranoid in my opinion. And, Hedda, I absolutely agree with you that it's inappropriate to post that garbage here or elsewhere. However, isn't your complaint about it (given your extensive history with the topic including a little regurgitation about Smiles in this very thread) just a wee bit hypocritical? I neither agree with or disagree with Peter's commentary but it's hardly "self serving." Perhaps we should all re-visit the second Labour of Hercules when he slew the great Hydra - and just hope the damn beast stays dead and buried.