Londoner

Following z909's post, I wish I'd added the fact that I'd already been to Pattaya three or four times where I experienced that same thrill of seeing cute guys who were available ...for a pittance. In fact, apart from Babylon, I was eager to get the bus to Pattaya where there were more of my type available. Not only that, but I was staying at a gay hotel (LeCafe Royale) where assignations were expected. In Bangkok, I'd used scuzzy short-time rooms because I didn't want to take visitors to my 4* hotel.

My first, obviously! May 1997. Dinner in Sphinx (probably squid salad and chicken with cashew nuts because that's always my favourite), a companion from Khun Cigar (sic), near Tantawan. And the next day, my first trip to Babylon which was then in its old premises .

It's good to talk about love sometimes. I know that I'm not the only one on this forum who is in a relationship and, at this difficult time, is finding it particularly hard to be so far away. And so, here's my contribution. One idiom that P always appreciates....come to think of it, it's about the only time I'm allowed to use my execrable Thai....is "Rak khun tao fah". I love you like the sky. Try it on your boyfriends. I find that it always brings a smile.

Boy69's post made me think. In our sixteen year relationship, P has only told me he loves me about twice. Many years ago, I once asked him why. After all, I often say that I love him. At this he smiled and then became coy. And then he said words to the effect that "it's not the Thai way to say it. You know what what's in my heart." I no longer expect it.

Yes....not that expensive by western standards . And, as Boy69 siad, send him the money through Western Union. Good luck.

I understand but at least you have a partner with whom you can share difficult times. I am thousands of miles away from mine, with no chance of seeing him for months. And anyway, for many people in our age group, isolation has its own problems when it comes to mental health issues like loneliness. Some are desperate for company.

I suspect that the virus spreads more quickly in cities. Perhaps the high number of Thais who live in rural areas may limit its spread. I write this for my own benefit because I'm trying to find something optimistic to say about P, who lives in rural Kamphaeng Phaet and whose relative isolation has bothered me. Until now.

The question isn't whether the bars will close-that was inevitable- but how many will ever re-open. Think of Sunee and the remnants of Boyztown....not many customers to lose there even before the virus arrived. Does anyone currently in Thailand have any idea of the levels of hotel occupancy? or of tourist arrivals?

z909 identifies the crucial issue for Thai saunas; us. There are simply too many aging falangs for the small number of cute , youngish (under 40s in my estimation) who frequent them. And yes, the problem is the cost of entry. I can never understand why under twenty-fives don't get in for 50 bht and ,as z909, a tiered fee after that. The young aren't there at the moment so what's to be lost? and, of course, the more twinks, the more high-paying falang. The best day I had at Babylon was about five years ago when the swimming pool was being renovated. A 50% reduction in cost resulted in far more younger guys. And far more enjoyment for me.

Yes indeed, allegedly owned by policemen, closed by.....? And ten (?) years on, the site still stands, rotting slowly away. No takers , it seems.

Babylon has the advantage of being open in the afternoons, unlike others which tend to open at about 1700. Asian guys (local and visiting) who like falangs are more likely to go there rather than elsewhere. In the present circumstances, I'd go in hope rather than expectation.

My preference is for reception to hold ID cards of visitors having first checked age and validity. That doesn't mean that joiners are "bothered"; in my experience they expect this process.. I also appreciate the phone call from reception when he leaves, checking that all is OK.

Wais are usually best avoided by falangs. They are more complicated than they appear....schools even had competitions to find the best exponent, wth the winners going on to local finals. Perhaps they still do. There's only one way to find out what you should do; ask your boy-friend what he wants. P taught me the correct position of the hands when I met Mama and Papa for the first time but they were relatively elderly country people with traditional views. I'd never wai-ed anyone before and have never done so since.

It looks very nice ....you are fortunate to be able to afford it.

Internet excellent when I was there in January. It appeared to involve new routers. Improved beds are welcome too. The breakfast is the best we've had in Thailand...much better than in a couple of significantly more expensive hotels in Phuket and Krabi we've recently visited. Agoda price was well below 2000 pn. Location unbeatable.

Yes....very pleasant rooms, reasonably priced. The minus is the location but guests with their own transport may not mind.

I visited Pattaya on more than forty occasion enjoying the butterfly-life. And then unexpectedly, unwillingly and against what I thought to be my better judgement, I fell in love with a guy I'd been offing regularly, but certainly not exclusively, for a year. That was in 2004. I am now pretty certain that, had I not done so, I'd no longer be such a regular (three times a year) visitor. Our needs change as we age. Or at least, mine did.

I was in LP last year. My estimation of the tourists there is that they largely consisted of two distinct groups; the elderly (UK readers will know what I mean if I call them Saga tourists) and the young backpackers. This neatly fits in with the hotel accommodation available; there are plenty of cheap places like we find in Chiang Mai. As far as the Chinese are concerned, on both occasion we were there, we saw coach-loads arriving at the National Museum in the early morning. They'd gone by the early afternoon. I didn't see many (or any?) in the evening in the restaurants or the markets. Nor on the boats. Responding to the question about Vientiane, P and I agreed that it was the least interesting of all our Asian destinations. The Mekong, so beautiful at LP, is hidden from view by ugly vegetation stretching a hundred metres from the corniche. The markets are purely local- food, clothes, home supplies- and we didn't find the restaurants anywhere near Thai standards. A couple of taxi jaunts to the country were OK. Just. In short, is is hardly a tourist destination. More of a commercial centre.

I've been to Bali twice with P. Very gay friendly (there's a gay travel service called Bali Friendly if you need transport around the island) but we didn't sample the gay life. Usually tucked-up in bed by the time it got going! The problem is the congestion on the roads around Kuta, Legian and Seminyak. But for a gay couple I cannot think of anything negative to mention. P. loves Bali and feels comfortable there. The other successful foreign visits have to been to Laos; Luang Prabang twice (highly recommended) and Vientiane (dull). No discernible gay life but full acceptance of us wandering around hand- in- hand. I can offer more personal advice, if required.

Keep an open mind. One thing I've noticed over the past few years is the number of ageing falangs wandering hand-in hand with Thais in their late thirties. Twenty years ago, the Thais would have been cute twenty-somethings. The reason, I suggests, is that contrary to received opinion on gay forums, some LTRs do work and result in long-lasting relationships. And yes, my boyfriend, aged thirty-eight, was holding hands with me (rather older) in Terminus 21 last week after seventeen years of.....well, quite a lot really.

Hornet- or at least its free version- has further limited the amount of info available on the guys. Sometimes it is almost non-existent. Often there is only one photo- a recipe for disappointment. The only free filters are for age and race. I'd suggest that Romeo has taken over from hornet in terms of ease of use and the extent of the location.. And the reason is that hornet has marketed its premium version so aggressively.

Welcome (Soi 4), Banana (Soi4), Hotmale (Patpong). Red Dragon may be good late in the evening ; I was too early on the nights I was in Bangkok.

The new PR is more suitable for tablets and phones. Make sure you switch on the "radar" so that you are restricted to local guys. Your geographical location must be correctly defined.Check the filter opportunities so that your numbers-quota (the choices that are screened) is restricted to the type of guy you are interested in. You don't want to waste valuable profiles on ageing falangs like myself! Here in Jomtien, i can access guys up to five miles plus away. I too didn't like it at first but now I believe it to be an improvement on Classic. By the way it is very similar to hornet, if you use that. Come to think of it, it's now faster.

The above is a harsher and probably more accurate assessment of the scene than mine. I didn't want to be too discouraging.There 's always the apps! I still think CM is a great place to visit and second traveller123's suggestion for a trip to the Chiang Rai district....for me one of the most beautiful in Thailand.

Chiang Mai is no Bangkok, nor a Pattaya....it's probably nor even a Phuket. The venues tend to be spread over a wide area, open late and are aimed at locals rather than tourists. Transport isn't as straightforward as you may be used to elsewhere. Try Adam's Apple if you seeking something similar to the Bangkok bars. Make sure you have the means of transport back to your hotel. But Chiang Mai is a fine location with fascinating temples and scenic trips outside the city or on the river. Twenty years ago, it had a small but thriving gay scene; nowadays, you have to seek it out.