vinapu

this is what I think too, in June ABomb and ToyBoys boys quoted 2000 long time , and another Toy Boy boy 1500 short and they seemed to be open to discussion but I did not bother to haggle. Some BBB boys may be asking for more and if popular getting it, if we pay it depends on horniness I guess. Nothing wrong with them trying, nothing wrong with us calling on competition instead.

it was my case on the first trip back in 2001, I was armed with all knowledge but did not know difference about short and long time and of course tipped short time boy long time rate / 2000 in BKK then / . It's why ever since I 'm overtipping I guess

with those I have no problem, those who say it you pay too much you are ruining an market for others I have problem with

it looks Boyztown is moving into BKK price levels

that would be me, only way to beat the crowds is to be there when everybody else still has breakfast. And heat is more bearable. Thing I remember most fondly from my trip there is 15 minutes I was alone on highest level of Angkor Wat and having Ta Som / small temple overgrown by a tree Ta Prohm style/ just to myself. I wish you luck !

this would reduce overpopulation big time This is how I see tipping issue - my microscopic part in spreading world's wealth more evenly / my underline / Can't agree with that, lots of people simply don't tip because whole practice is foreign to them and their culture they grew up within. there were whole threads devoted to the issue but nobody ever said that paying 1500 $ for a flight which could be had for 1000 or 100 $ for a hotel room which could be had for 60 $ is doing the same ruin. I'd say If I'm paying over the 'norm" I'm ruining it for myself first as chances are I will be visiting place again on the same trip so boy and his friends will expect no less next time. Still do what I think it suits me best.

If they are hounding you for a tip give then just 1 baht coin and they may leave you alone, worked for me on those few occasions I was there / boys there are not of my type although there's always one or two very digestible /

looking around and in the mirror I believe you are correct. Those trained from childhood not to ask for help if they can perform task for themselves seem to cope with being alone either by choice or circumstances much better than those who could count on somebody to open door for them for most of their lives.

but I realize , it's easier said than done. Even after all those years and trips sometimes heart is fast pumping when taking those escalators to Arena or walking down Sala Daeng to Senso

Very good point / my underline /. Boy is not a mind reader but if client makes right moves he will get what you are waiting for. One can talk directly to a boy which would be my preferred way if I had any specifics in mind, of course as long as he can speak some of the language you speak. Don't be shy as they heard it all before All boils down to what is important to you, some will go for massage with sex as side dish in whatever form, for others it will be sex part which is important with massage as a side or even distraction. Keep your mind open, when you both are undressed you may change your priorities either way and so may the boy. Or just go for a boy you like look of the most and who smiles at you and see what happens. You may be happier even if not all mechanics will work. That's may way and not only mine on this forum , after all you are looking for warm human not a sex / massage machine. And if he likes you he may be more accommodating to what you like too. Once one of Arena boys offed long time confessed to me that he only agreed to go long time, his first ever , after he talked to other boys who vouched for me. In now-defunct FanClub was a boy who would not agree to a kissing beforehand but in the room he turned out to be good kisser. He wanted to sniff the client so to speak and actually openly admitted it. That's the beauty of human interaction, witch turns to just a charmer and sometimes other way around.

Finally you learned how to answer , LOL

if cheapest prices are somebody's foremost goal. Sometimes this may clash with fun expected to be had

waiting impatiently

Now at least I know I'm consistent

1 no, it's not what I meant. If you are in non-tipping place that all is fine but if you sense that they expect tip and you don't , then I'd avoid this place for a while 2. I agree but trying to reverse it single handily will be impossible. Yes it us tourists who are corrupting locals but on another hand we help to create environment in which we have fun and they have a job. Brilliant statement about spiral of lowering wages. It also helps on cheating on taxes since servers tend to underestimate their tips for that purpose. But problem with all included is one Traveller123 noticed above - owners , not servers get unduly share of service charges. In Thailand I tip but don't consider those who don't cheap since as you noticed this is non-tipping culture.

At least by debating those usually we arrive to some conclusions which can't be said about UN Security Council debating the same peace in the Middle East since 1948 and going nowhere. Obviously there's interest in those subjects and most of us taking part in discussion know what they are talking about. But in between, there's tons of practical information of use to both new and regular visitors.

Correct , for example at this very moment I'm typing it 22 members and 150 visitors, all welcomed I haste to add

I read all three forums and Christian blog daily time permitting but have a time to contribute only here, we are least moderated and best behaved of all three.

With one of most magnificent cluster of ruins in the whole world it's just a blasphemy / my underline /. If one is templed-out , Tonle Sap lake and it's floating villages are nice respite. I recommend trip up to Kulen mountain / take swimsuit to use at waterfall/ as well as carved riverbed of Kbal Spien with 'pink' temple of Banteai Srei mnetion ed by divine Madman and landmine museum on the way. As for temples I recommend less known , as impressive as main ones but much less crowded since most package tourists are crowding at Bayon , Angkor Wat, Preah Khan and Ta Prohm leaving others for more adventuros types.

I'm glad you realized that spending money that way would be spending money on yourself rather than boy. He may have better use of money than flying or taking sleeper train. So yes, if you like him , rather give him money.

thanks for a good laugh / my underline / As for a thread subject itself I can only recall my immediate impression when I came to Pattaya for a first time. Only preconceived notion I had was that it will be hooker at every turn which did not materialize but I was surprised my number of sad faced farangs wandering the streets. It is recorded in my trip report from Nov 2013 so I'm not making it up. So I guess some of them may feel lonely , free of burden to friends and too much money and surrounded by the culture they did not fully grasp .

at least avatar is matching

It seems tipping will be always contentious issue. I live in a tipping culture but still almost always when I have a meal with friends in restaurant, discussion about how much to tip is guaranteed. But one thing seems to be certain - if you want to tip somebody , make sure you give money to that person.If you just leave on the table or put in the tip box , chances are somebody else will get it. Few days ago I bought take out meal in a bar nearby and threw a change in a tip box. Lady behind the cash told me / we speak the same language so she could be brave to say it loudly / "don't bother because our owner will take it for himself anyways"

still there are exceptions. In June one of my boys offed few times previously all of the sudden in the morning came with request of 1000 more of what he was receiving from me before, I suspect inspired by his friend from the bar who did the same. Knives are sharpened for revenge already, LOL

I'm somewhat surprised so far with poll. Over years judging by responses in various threads I thought people like me sealing deal up front are minority but it seems not so.