vinapu

that's advantage of dealing with Thai boys and Thais in general, they are extremely polite as long as we don't rile them off, worse you may hear is some excused 'no'

are we any better? Just this week talked to friend who sold her mortgage free big house and was lucky to get much better price than listed. Downsized to small apartment so obviously has excess money and ever since according to her is constantly harassed by family and friends to lend them some money for this or that. And we are talking quite well off people in well off country so why Pattaya Thais should be different? I fully agree with last sentence above ' based solely on who has a money' or perceived as such.

First , you worry too much, boys heard and saw it all and much more so worst what may happened they may tell you no and it will be polite. They may not take a dildo but would not object to playing with you with, at least not tops I imagine. I understand your lack of courage for fear of rejection, my advice will be, found boy you like , have a massage with him, if you like an experience tell him you will return tomorrow or even later that day. On second time you will be braver and boy knowing you better more accommodating too , particularly if you tipped him fair on the first encounter /. fair , not excessively since he will expect even bigger tip with some kink /. With underwear sniff /trade your biggest problem is their extremely cleanliness and I can't recall their odorous undies. You can try boys from Bonny or Bangkok Massage at end of day as they are sitting outside in the heat so may get some saturation where you want. Or off boy long time , turn A/c down a bit, present him with new undies and make him sleep in them clinging tightly to you.Try to get him off but don't go all the way, repeat at 3a.m and 6 . In the morning you may get some flavor and boy can keep his original clean garments and a tip.

may be he just wasn't in the mood? Anyways nothing wrong with poking and withdrawing, better then those guys who are sitting without ordering a drink and just taking space and air.

Hope you will find it, as reported previously I tried last month but without any success in sois 93 to 97/1. Let us know if you will find it, you can even call me blind or dumb. Nothing wrong with bars not being your thing, I for one feel the same about saunas and whole soi 4. We all have our likes and dislikes and this is what keeps all sort of diverse businesses alive.

I'm 100% not beach person but I think tourists who consider beach very important are not heading for Pattaya, it's just an addition to other charms of the place IMNSHO.

I like this expression, we learn something new every day

This doesn't mean anything. In December on few different occasions I bar-hopped both in PTY and BKK with 4 members of this board / z909, firecat, Christian nad xiluzer / and lesson learned is what is 'nothing of interest ' for one of us may be gem for another. Neither they were with mine nor I was impressed with their choices and this is very good sign - it means every boy have a chance. Only exception was xiluzer who is fond of exactly the same types I like. so bottom line is - go and check for yourself. As for Love Thailand comment about Sunee I must say that even if that plaza is not my piece of cake at all in all 5 go-gos I visited last month I did not see drastically too young looking specimens. ID still should be checked for peace of mind but Sunee likely cleaned their act or may be I'm being naive. But again I'm not familiar with younger sector of working boys and leave all under 25 y.o, 170 cm and 60 kg to others

Jacuzzi treatment includes attendant boy. Nothing will stop you from inserting boy to the tube with you. This would be environmentally friendly action since less water will be used As for flow of events there are 2 scenarios: either you direct what happens or you leave to the boy to steer course of action. Second option is my favorite in all massage places. Mind you I'm not lying there like piece of wood and at times my wandering hands are even gently slapped but generally I leave it to the boy to take an initiative and see where it leads us. This is when I'm on their turf. When I off boy , in my room I like to be in charge but no, I don't slap gently his wandering hands.

OP, did you fell in love since you silent for last few days? How things are going?

in such a case I'd secure boy by paying off fee up front and telling mamasan time I will pick him up. This is what I did at BoyZBoyZBoyz on both occasions last trip. In meantime managed to visit few bars without boy and corresponding drink in tow.

my approach to long time and I almost exclusively off long time is to tell boy that in the morning we will have breakfast together. This does the trick of letting him know what I mean by the long time and gives them a chance of presenting their own time limits if any. Usually does the trick although I had an exception in December by the XSize boy who left after 1 hour or so. In the morning it's boy's choice if he goes for breakfast with me or not, usually they do, if they don't it's their loss. I must say that in 10 trips massage boys offed never cut me on time but go-gos from time to time did - on two occasion last trip reported above.

I like your approach and I'm using the same, no games. If I invite boy to sit with me I always tell him up front that either we only watch the show together and after that he is free because I'm not offing anybody or we watch the show and than he goes with me. No drama , no disappointments. It helps that usually I know very fast if I'm interested in anybody in the line or not. I taker mercy on boys and let them know my intentions fast so they can focus on other clients if I'm not interested in.

since I'm not fan of beach areas, visited only for few hours in Dec and can attest that Bamboo bar is still in operation during day and has quite a few cute and willing boys on duty. Former Derby massage on the way to Jomtien Complex is now mixed massage place. Hope others will chip in with more info

boy is supposed to have it, for us is optional since we are ATM we can afford not having one

those eruptions I'd be leaving for later part in privacy of my or short time room, not in bar , even in Sunee

some people are plain cheap but some simply are frozen by experience completely new for them and don't know how to behave in such a bar. Hope they do some research and loose up next visit. I recall my first ever visit in now defunct bar on Rama IV, did not have an idea what to expect inside and how to behave, to made matters worse / or better / fuck show participants started their circulation among audience just when I entered. So I felt like just getting heart attack in heaven's gate. Thanks God, mamasan sensed me up and explained goings and procedures. He even suggested which boy to take and where / Suriwong short rooms /. Only thing he did not explain is difference between short and long time so I tipped boy long time rate / 2000 then / for short time and still remember sound he made when got that much not to mention highest wai I ever saw. Since then I actually kind of like mamasans and don't consider then nuisance like some others. If I ever see uptight farangs in bar beside me I ask them if that's their first time and at least twice tried to be helpful with guidance to repay original debt.

You are not cheap, 100 baht is fair amount, after all it buys two meals in the street stand. I was told that this is also all bottom in fuck shows were paid by the bar. But before we grope the boy we need to make sure this is approved practice in the bar. Customs in Nature Boy or Eros are not exactly the same like in Jupiter or BoyzBoyBoyz. No need to embarrass boy and ourselves

It's not my custom to criticize other's tipping habits but if one is sitting with boy and gropes him I'm of very strong opinion that compensating tip / 100-300, depending on length of time and activities involved / must be paid because normally we don't grope strangers sitting beside us. If somebody doesn't he is not just cheap Charlie, it's just plain asshole. Boys don't have any duty to make themselves available for our dirty hands. If boy is invited to sit with us deserves tip even if we did not tough him as we may be prevent him from getting more generous customer. If he is planting beside on his own we are free to ignore him if we wish. Those sitting on their hands are absolved as long as I'm concerned as long as they can survive constant barrage by mamasans to buy a drink and off the boy as long as they keep their hands of. They are not helping anybody's bottom line other than his own but I'd say let them have it. They may be frequent visitors , temporary short of cash or shy newcomers who don't know how to behave in bar. Tawan recently prevented this kind of behavior by selling admission tickets at front which can inside be exchanged for a drink - I liked an idea

my favorite wine is gin

showering in undies is very rare but known to science, may be he was just shy or new to farangs. Combined with no getting hard / very rare occurrence / my verdict would be he was straight so no bottom either. If you want top or bottom , ask for one but on another hand this would be hint that you are not interested in massage so boy may go to the business faster than you wish. From my experience best way to ensure you will get proper massage is to tell boy that you don't have sex with boys. Nothing stops you from changing your mind several minutes later and signal change of mind by toughing him where sun doesn't shine.

This is not universal as I recall quite a few cases when boy was unreasonable, settled down on much lower rate than he originally requested / like half / and still kept his part of bargain after that. I don't mind them trying to skin me alive and probably at times they get some newbie who will pay whatever they want, thing I hate is when something is negotiated and than story is changing in order to leave earlier or not do what they promised to. But this is mercifully rare though.

I must say that with massage boys I rarely if ever had problem with cutting time short, even if all was finished before time purchased elapsed they at least asked what we do now and always were willing to spend remaining time cuddling and feeling each other. With go-gos not so rosy and I agree with Christian that sometimes they try to maximize income and minimize time but to their credit I must say those short cutters are still rather small minority. Starting negotiations about time and money is rare but again I agree that this is hint that they may be too commercial although on few occasions boy asked how much I will give him, which I have no problem answering. To their credit again I don't recall situation that they tried to bargain , I on another hand quite often try to bargain them down. I usually ask them up front how much they want and need to say that old answer ' up to you ' slowly but surely is giving way to some monetary quotation and if they are trying too high I'm not shy to bargain. Rarely they are going over board though although I had Tawan boy who wanted 3000 for 1 hr and he was not top of their line. We settled down a bit lower / 2500 for 2 hr, still too much /, he was great but still tried to leave before negotiated end, which is not what I like. If you ask me , I'd prefer if numbers are discussed up front and wouldn't mind Japanese style of price list nailed somewhere in the bar.

you hunt Caucasians in LOS and just feast on Thai eye candy for free?

nothing wrong with that if that's what's one is looking for but it wouldn't be me for sure