vinapu

extorting money from newcomers is age old and world wide phenomena and very few places world over are free from this disease. I don't even think Bangkok is particularly bad in this respect. It's why many cities are actually mandating flat rates from the airport to prevent tourists being skinned alive by taxi drivers As for limited budget - I always thought that travelers on limited budget don't even contemplate taking taxi unless all other options are non existing. They are waiting for the bus/train.

I'm glad that is the case , bars should be taking care of their employees and not force then to take any occasional loony which may show at the door .After all we don't know whom we are taking to the room but also boys are taking great risk going with strangers. Although on personal level I'm not happy with your explanation due to incident I had at Tawan in May when after arrangement was sealed off all of the sudden boy announced that he must go with another customer. I was hoping his excuse was management pressure, now in view of what you said it looks he had greener pastures in mind. As for freelancers - it explains why sometimes when arranging subsequent visits with the offed guys they insist to give them off money so they will pay bar fines themselves ,even offering discount. Most likely they are pocketing money and simply not showing at the bar for work that night. Not a difference viewing from my pocket though.

yes , but not just you

is not easy to be pioneer I guess . In view of what happened to Australian baby with Down syndrome , story mentioned at end of article, I'm not surprised Thai government banned practice. In one day we will have international convention regulating issue but now each side of surrogacy seem to be at mercy of other

1. preparing for a trip and searching for an information can be as much fun as trip itself so I wouldn't make it too easy for prospective travelers depriving them part of pleasure, search feature works very well here 2. no joking , your drink and feast of chicken with cashew nuts is on me when we meet, you have it in writing here. Don't worry about fighting over the same man, I'm not competitive. I visited quite a few bars and massage places on couple of occasions with one our of members with the same taste and not even once we liked exactly the same guy, there's always something to make for tiny difference so peace is guaranteed. By the way those tours with other members are highlight of trip for me and always fun to find face behind the posts so we will figure something out to co-ordinate trip timing.

I think in some places they may be pressed by management to go with any client, it why I always look for smile or at least eye contact to make sure he has some real or well faked interest in me.

traffic yes but taxis? You must have a bad luck with them, use BTS , MRT and express boats, don't tempt bad luck

what they quote for BKK-Pattaya trip ?, just curious I doubt it makes sense for average tourist to use UBER considering how abundant taxis are and how horrendous traffic is at daytime. It took me twice as long to get from Ekkamai to Sala Daeng by taxi at 11 a.m. than reverse direction by BTS 1 hour earlier, cost 42 BTS vs.106 taxi

as so are mine, I also agree with firecat that taxis are such a good value in BKK that is not worth getting upset over small change in comparison to prices elsewhere. Few times succumbed to flat fare offers but they never were extortionate considering distance or circumstances. Only offer I always summarily reject is frequently quoted past midnight 150 from Suriwong to Malaysia Hotel / meter is about 60 / . If they won't accept 100 I wait whole 20 seconds for next taxi to appear.

I like your way of thinking

rest assured there's not even remotest chance of that thank you for great reports showing us parts of Thailand few of us venture in That guy may be spot on with beach observation. When reading forums we have guys proclaiming that they are not visiting bars anymore and then complaining about slim pickings in them longing for days of old when even water was more moist then is now

I'm of opinion that when on vacation being in transit is not wasting time -rather is an opportunity to savor and experience environment I will be spending my vacations in. In Bangkok bonus is abundance of eye candy in the train. This , not opportunity to save money is reason I very rarely use taxis , usually only in the dead on night for lack of other options. But as you said above - everybody in making own choices. I admire steel nerves of those who are taking taxis for the final trip to the airport from PTY . I'd never put myself through what anonone just described , rather opt for final night in BKK. But I'm of high blood pressure already.

I support firecat's assertion that taxis in BKK are very good value pricewise. Whether using them at day time saves time is debatable because of scandalic traffic jams throughout most of the day but at least one is sitting in air conditioned environment. Offer of medal should be withdrawn immediately though at 400 is quite reasonable, Meter from Sawmpy to BBBInn is 255, plus 70 tolls plus 50 airport surcharge for a total of 375, 400 is hardly extortion. I use taxis to/from airport very rarely but 2 years ago I paid 600 required without hesitation as I was hailing it at 3 a.m. during deluge

and because your sizable and varied statistic sample I'd trust your assessment

OP assertion is misplaced but at least discussion on the subject is lively

My experience and not only with Thailand is if they have free room , hotels will let you to check in early without charge. Some travelers are trying to economize and nothing wrong with it as long as they prefer to sleep on the airport bench till morning in order to save.

this time it was smart move to leave, if you don't see any interest from the boy they won't be chemistry and money will be wasted. Rule I observe for myself is - no smile exchange , no off. Nice to know muscle boys start shoving up in the Sunee.

While I agree that this was dumb move by the bar and it happens from time to time in any bar was saving 150-200 baht really worth of getting upset and spoiling day of your vacations? Since you call boy over I assume you liked him so you missed possibly very nice off too. I'd say bar etiquette is if you call boy over to talk you buy him a drink. If you want just to off the boy just wave him over , ask if he wants to go with you, tell him to dress, pay off fee and off you go. But this is usually done if you know boy already , no need to sit and talk. Enjoy your vacation, loosen up a bit and never forget you are on vacations, smile a lot and don't get upset over cost of drinks in PTY, And welcome to the forum and report from time to time your adventures

I wonder of how much truth is in that. My guess would be that this is impression of farangs spending too much time in Sunee Plaza. Since I share the bkkmfj's taste I must say I never feel somehow singled out when visiting bars or massages. I'm not disputing you may be correct but I find words "a-typical" and "immensely" misplaced in the context. What I agree with is that skinny twinks admirers are much more vocal on the forums thus creating an impression of being immense and typical majority.

I'm glad bkkmfj you finally made it to LOS after 18 months hiatus. Can't wait for next installment of your report, your writing style is great and details are all in the right places. Somebody can use report as a real guide to CM places. Boys are gorgeus and I'm sure you had a fun with them. Noted 6 hands massage impression, you were one to recommend me 4 hands and I'm glad I took your word for it and if you say 6 hands is too much which confirms my suspicion, I'll skip trying it. Don't worry about abidismaili comments - by far you are not alone in your taste in Thai guys, rest assured even on this forum they are guys who'd gladly discuss world peace with your guides.

money speaks but not always loudly enough. I sometimes wonder if they are into it for money why they don't want long time for twice as much preferring short time for much less or 1 hr over 2 hr massage course? Why top boy doesn't want to hear even about bottoming for any money on the first engagement but on second or third seems to warm into idea? Why boys goes gladly into threesome with guy from another bar but for no amount of money would go with co-worker? and so on... Money boys are not machines but men with their feelings and idiosyncrasies, some do everything for money some have limits here and there just like all of us working people. So if they are not into farangs they don't sell their wares to them. Would we do everything at work our boss may ask us to do for any money? I'd never exchange vacation time for money but know many people who'd gladly do

firecat I'm last to question your reasoning but I was trying to show that different people have different calculations in mind for different reasons. After you land past midnight if you were to wait for first train to Phaya Thai at 6.00 you'd be surprised how many faces familiar from flight are on the train, rationale of waiting being savings not only on taxi but also on first, very short night in the hotel. I was presented with this logic on at least three occasions by random travelling companions over the years Not long ago Christian reported meeting on the flight to BKK guy whose goal was to get from Swampy to Cambodian border at Poipet for under 3$. Achievable by the way, logic of such self flagellation escaping me but obviously not a guy in question. Bottom line is trying to rationalize spending habits of others is an exercise in futility. We can help with advice but trying to understand motives of others when comes to spending is wasting energy.

Common illusion is that we humans always make a rational financial decisions. I can see at least 4 reasons for doing the above although I haste to say , I'm none of those types. 1. Technology freaks, those are people who use internet do do almost everything, they order pizza over internet instead of calling so why not a shuttle 2. Big name lovers, who wouldn't sleep in hotel without Holiday Inn or Hilton name, eat at McDonald or Sizzler, drink only Starbucks cofee etc so they feel home with Expedia but not Lek's Taxi Service 3. Unsecure types, afraid of unknown who don't leave home without all reservations made , tickets purchased, maps uploaded and so on 4.Points freaks collecting reward points on every purchase including 1.50 coca-cola so why not on shared shuttle.

For me for first 8 trips Thailand was transit country on my way to or from somewhere in the region. First time I arrived at night and first thing in the morning after breakfast I went to Saphan Taksin BTS took boat to Grand Palace and before arrived there I fall madly in love with the country. Sure , later on in the day I tried my first massage and in the evening first bar but by that time my feelings were established and had nothing to do with sleaze which is existing of course and thanks God for that. Truth is while abundant most of sleaze is well hidden, not too many people wander to soi Cowboy or Nana Plaza by chance. Patpong 1 and Walking street are a bit different but if somebody is not interested after few steps will notice what is going on and can escape easily with grace. Yes I also had my suit made to measure and 14 years later proudly use it for weddings and funerals, still squeezing in easily which makes for good feeling. And great deals on multi stars hotels are as easily to be had like they were then making Thailand one of the best existing deals for the money with Third World prices for First World values. While not particular big fan of Thai food chicken with cashew nuts notwithstanding I like what is on offer at any given time feasting mostly on fruits. But Thailand biggest asset are her people, welcoming and warm. It’s just enough to sit in famous Bangkok traffic for while to realize that in every other place on the wide world it would be cacophony of honking cars and swearwords while there everybody somehow manages to keep composure. So while sleaze is accessible and well organized for which most of us here are grateful I ’d not call Thailand Land of Sleaze sticking to smiles instead. And anybody who doubts in Thailand charms apart from Soi Twilight and Boyztown just start reading Christian’s blog since he is doing outstanding job finding all those both hidden and well visible charms for us.

two boys on the pedestal in front of gay flag look very inviting