hornyfrog

Even if you’ve seen a GP around for years or hired him before, don’t assume that means zero risk. The less time you spend here, the less you’ll know. I know of both tourists and residents who let their guards down and ended up robbed, threatened, drugged, or even injured in their apartments in Brazil. It’s not super-common — and it’s reported less here when it’s two men involved than when a woman garota de programa robs a male client — but it happens enough to stay alert. Filing a police report, an arrest, or even a sauna ban doesn’t always make someone vanish — the same faces can reappear later. Saunas at least provide some accountability. Outside of that, lock up your valuables and never assume that past good encounters guarantee the next one will be safe.

When a CPF number or an ID number is “sunk” (dirty) in the Brazilian banking system (overdrawn, reported or suspected fraud, sometimes even theft), any Pix with that CPF number are suspended. Any deposits into that person’s account immediately go towards paying off the debt. Brazilians who ask for this are usually in this kind of situation. It’s best not to get involved at all. But there’s always the client who wants to be seen as Santa.

You can also do this with Mercado Pago. It requires a minimum pre-loaded balance of 1000 reais.

I’m not trying to sound like a gatekeeper here, but most GPs want to get paid immediately after the service ends, unless they know you well and trust you enough that they will get paid soon enough. As a non-Brazilian resident, if you’re using Pix through Wise, Remitly or another remittance transfer service. It can take hours to even a day for the transfer to complete… and the first time you send to someone, you need to have a whole lot of info on that recipient in Brazil — full name, residential address, CPF, banking info, sometimes the address of bank — the exact Pix code the receiver uses (CPF, mobile number, or email) for the bank account to deposit it into. If you already have a Brazilian bank account, Pix is very fast and reliable. The speed is NOT reliable if you’re remitting it from an international bank. Most of these working guys do not have hours to wait for their couple of hundred reais from you — especially not from a tourist that could skip town the next day without payment (yes, that happens!). Also, there are times when certain garotos can’t access their Pix or their bank accounts are blocked, and they need to get paid in cold hard cash. It’s no guarantee who this will be, so you had better know this upfront before booking the date! Don’t assume everyone accepts Pix at all times. As a Brazilian resident with a bank account here, I use Pix, Wise and Remitly almost all the time — but when I wasn’t a resident, its reliability and speed of arrival was a lot less predictable.

Wow. Well, I’m glad to see the term still being used, because I only heard it in the UK a few decades ago — and thought it sounded much more refined and less derogatory than other nicknames more popular on the other side of the pond — like john or trick. Although here in Brazil, it’s just a simple “cliente”.

Sorry, I’m not sure if you took offense to my comment or not. But if you did, I didn’t mean to offend.

My Brazilian immigration attorney here just told me that there is no indication in available sources that a vote is scheduled in the Chamber of Deputies regarding the revocation of the visa reinstatement. All recent reports here indicate the bill has stalled after passage in the lower house, the Senate. There is resistance in the Chamber of Deputies due to the US tariffs issue, and allies of Chamber Speaker Motta have indicated in the Brazilian press that the bill is unlikely to come to a vote there soon.

My point is that they could very well know the difference — but not care. You as a US citizen think a millionaire is poor compared to a billionaire. To a working-class (or poor) Brazilian, it’s all relative. To be in the top 1% of income earners in Brazil in 2024, an individual needs only a monthly minimum income of approximately R$35,000 - R$45,000, which is around $6,480 - $8,300 USD a month. The average monthly income for a salaried individual in Brazil is around only 3,343 BRL ($620 USD) and the minimum monthly wage (of which 1/3 to 1/2 of all Brazilians receive less than) is only R$ 1,518, or $280 USD, per month. So, after a certain threshold, those pedantic numbers about millionaires and billionaires in the USA that you’re posting would not even matter to the overwhelming number of Brazilians. Still, there are enough Brazilians (some of them are garotos) who associate wealth (and class) — at the very least, lots of disposable income or credit — with anyone from certain countries like the USA. “Trailer park trash”, “house and car poor”, and “nouveau riche” are not concepts that they are vert culturally familiar with. When Calvin Klein visited 117 and Lagoa he was generous to the boys as well as to the house, but it’s not like he was paying in proportion to his net worth. Which was the point of my previous post. if Geffen were to come to Brazil for his boy toys (and who’s to say that he did not?) , he most certainly would not pay $10,000 USD (R$ 54,000 BRL) on Garoto com Local. Yes, word gets around who the clients (whether local and visiting) who are very well-off, and who the pretenders and the stingy, are.

Slightly off-topic, but possibly interesting nonetheless: I haven’t heard that term “punter” used to mean “a man who hires sex workers” outside of United Kingdom ever, and not in maybe 30 years.

I don’t think you’re understanding. The point is that to many Brazilians, there is no difference between billionaire David Geffen and an American schlub who works in a cubicle. That average-to above-average earning cubicle supervisor at a paper clip company could be a 1%(a milionário) in Brazil. Try telling a favelado in Jacaré that you as a traveling gringo staying in Zona Sul are not rich.

Be careful if your point is that clients should proportionally pay according to how much they are worth. Because in Brazil. many regular, average American, Canadian and Western European income earners would place at or near the top 1%. So, using a sliding scale, that garoto de programa who charges a Brazilian client R$ 150 should charge a US client 5 times that much!

There are some muscle boys and physique model types in Rio and São Paulo who are asking for and getting R$ 500 - R$700 for a 30 minute to 1 hour outcall (at your place). Going over an hour with one of them could run you 1000 to 1400 reais. I have heard of some tourists at saunas paying 500 reais for the half-hour sauna sessions for what they consider top-notch garotos de programa. But these prices are not the norm, not even close. Geffen paid his soon to be ex-husband $10,000 USD on their first date after meeting him on the Sugar Daddy website, Seeking Arrangements. So, keep it all in proper perspective!

I honestly can’t really advise you properly on all of this. Maybe you just need a sounding board? — which is fine, we all do every now and then. But you’d probably be better off contacting some of the larger Brazilian-based as well as global medical insurance companies, asking for an English-speaking agent and getting a custom quote. These sound to me like intensely personal decisions based on very personal preferences, as you do seem to have great options that others in your age group might not be fortunate enough to have. If you truly do love your life where you are now as you say, then maybe just keep traveling at your leisure instead of uprooting to another continent for a host of unknowns is better for you? The expats (permanent residents) that I know here either have a private insurance plan, use SUS, travel back to their own countries for healthcare, or a combination of these. No one I know says that healthcare costs here in Brazil are more expensive than they would be in the USA. But I get that you live in Canada — which is not close to being the health insurance hellscape that is the USA. Full disclosure: I have a global medical insurance plan, and I also have my private health insurance back in the USA from my pension plan but that is not global and can’t be used abroad. And then I have more than half a decade until Medicare kicks in (if it’s actually still around when I become eligible — the way the US government is going, no one can be confident), which also only works in The States. But I have had my global plan for years (like 15), and I have been here in Brazil for several years and am approaching 60. I would imagine that someone seeking a similar plan starting in their 60s and beyond would pay significantly more than someone who initiated the plan in their 40s. Good luck in your journey!

It’s entirely possible that even if your Airbnb hostess gets paid at her job in Brazilian reais, even if she is considered upper middle-class in Brazil and owns an apartment in a cute area like Ipanema or Copacabana, that she could be spending half or close to half of her monthly income on private health insurance premiums. If she is making R$ 7000 a month (about $1300 USD a month), in Rio that’s puts her at around the top quarter of earners in Rio. A comprehensive single plan with Unimed might run an older person or someone with preexisting conditions or comorbidities about R$ 3500 to maybe as much as R$ 5000. So, you can see how someone with even a much better than average income in Brazil can spend a lot of private health insurance premiums. if you’re becoming a resident of Brazil on a retirement or investment visa, or even the newfangled remote work / digital nomad visa, you’re getting paid / bringing in money in a non-Brazilian currency, and those required minimums to qualify are more than the 7000 BRL that I just mentioned. The minimum needed to qualify for a retirement visa in Brazil is currently 2000 USD a month in pension payments. So if that minimum or close to it is your monthly amount, and the best health insurance you can get is costing you 1000 USD, that’s half gone right there.

I relocated to Brazil on an investment visa and now have permanent residency. I am close to several other expats who have come to Brazil on the pension / retirement visa and have residency cards as well.

Hello. I own a place here in Rio and now live here permanently as a resident. I was granted an investment visa for business several years back My friends group here in Brazil consists of several other expats (gay, straight and all things in between) who have permanent residency or citizenship in Rio or other parts of Brazil due to work, retirement, investment, marriage / family, etc. Many, like me — but not all — are also originally from the US. Some are originally European, some are Asian, one is Australian, a few from other South American countries, one from Africa. Two of them are immigration lawyers who live / work in Brazil and run a expat immigration / relocation consulting firm, and it’s very busy right now with lots of US citizens trying to expatriate to other countries ASAP (easy to guess why). Out of courtesy / respect, I am not going to post or provide any names or links on here without any permissions, but feel free to DM me if you have any questions, and I will try to lead you in the right direction. Brazil can be a bureaucratic nightmare (the famous saying here is “Brazil is not for beginners”), so getting knowledgeable experienced help with boots on the ground to navigate the entire process would be best. But in spite of its myriad of complications and issues, no one I know has ever regretted moving here.

Sexy Rose is an XXX video booth store with cruising and a dark room / dark spaces — like what you might used to see in old-time 70s / 80s / 90s in New York City or other major US cities. You pay an entrance fee and go inside. It’s not really a place for hustlers, pay boys or garotos de programa, it’s just for clients or regular horny guys with their own personal tastes and proclivities in men — so your money doesn’t talk there. Sometimes, they might oddly have a DJ or some gogo boys. It’s in Centro, in the Cinelandia area, which is quite a bit grimy and not a place you want to be alone when it’s getting dark. You can check in your bookbag at the front, if you are hesitant to have valuables with you while cruising in dark areas. Next to Sexy Rose is an old adult movie theatre called Cine Rex — a darkened theatre área where clients (mostly older) mess around, either in the open or in dark corners, or on the old theatre seats. There are almost always a few cheap hustlers in there, as well as at least one tranny. It doesn’t smell so great, like old piss and bathrooms that aren’t cleaned enough. Definitely another “at your own risk” visit, and like any dark cruising spot, it’s not wise to have any valuables with you.

I answered à similar question in the “Over 65” subject thread here. Pix is the Brazilian version of Zelle in the USA. Pix is for quick transfer from Brazilian bank account to Brazilian bank account — but if you do not have an account here and thus no Pix, you can also use a remittance service like Wise or Remitly ot even Western Union to send money into a Brazilian’s account through Pix — for an additional add-on fee. It’ll just take more information from both parties (like name, address, address and number of bank), and it can take up to 24 hours for the money to be transferred and deposited. Most garotos, especially ones you don’t know and thus, they cannot trust you, will NOT be willing to accept being paid hours or a day after the programa is done. Tons of true tales about garotos not trusting gringos who tell them they will pay them or the money is on the way, and then that gringo skips town. So, remittance apps are normally NOT an option for the occasional tourist to pay their providers.

That’s good news. You are truly an outlier. It looks like Banco Rendimento has a Non-Resident Account that requires a CPF and a few other documents to open, but not a residency number like an RG. May I ask exactly you how long have you had this account — like how many years? You say “forever”. I strongly suspect that this is a relatively new development for this bank, like with the advent of digital app-based banking. Brief searching shows that other than Rendimento, only Santander and BTG Pactual are also offering non-resident accounts. NuBank has begun setting up some document waivers for its “high deposit” accounts, so that also might be a place to start if one is willing to start with and maintain what probably adds up to several thousand USD or Euros à month in a digital Brazilian bank account.

This isn’t quite correct. Although you first do need a CPF number to get a Brazilian bank account, you ALSO need a residency number. In other words, non-Brazilian citizens or non-residents can’t open Brazilian bank accounts. As a resident here in Rio, I have heard there might be one or two rare incidents of banks allowing tourists or non-residents to open an account, but I have yet to see that confirmed. These are like urban legends! Also, Pix is for quick transfer from Brazilian bank account to Brazilian bank account — but if you do not have an account here and thus no Pix, you can also use a remittance service like Wise or Remitly ot even Western Union to send money into a Brazilian’s account through Pix. It’ll just take more information from both parties, and it can take up to 24 hours for the money to be transferred and deposited (most garotos, especially ones you don’t know and thus, they cannot trust you) will NOT be willing to accept being paid hours or a day after the programa is done.

I get the idea behind charging the GP a few reais to work at the club. One: they are independent contractors by Brazilian law (although adult sex work is legal here, third-party procuring or pimping is outlawed), and as such, the entrance fee serves to separate the sauna business from the independent worker. Also, with the high risk of having any old ne’er-do-well walking in the club, you do need some kind of barrier to entry. Everyone should have some skin in the game. However, that entry fee for workers should be minimal. These kinds of clubs will fail without new youngbloods — and those kinds of guys in Brazil can’t afford much.

This should’ve read “one price for those with Brazilian IDs and another more expensive one for those without).”

If I were part of the 117 management team (definitely NOT my dream job!), I would: — Make the client entrance fees two-tier (one price for those with Brazilian IDs and another less expensive one for those without). Locals are the regular clients, and the less they have to pay to enter the club, the more they can spend on suites and at the bar. — Drop the garoto entrance fee to something more affordable (that wouldn’t cause the GPs to raise their programa prices on clients to cocer the additional entrance fees). — Offer GPs a work incentive: the top 3 GPs who book clients who spend the most / book the most time in suites will each get their entrance fees comped. This would encourage GPs to get clients to spend more in-house vs. just getting WhatsApp numbers and going offsite. The meat of the sauna’s money comes from clients spending money inside the club (in suites or at the bar) — not from GPs paying an entrance fee.

Just for clarification purposes… Coroa and bear / urso are not the same thing, although they can overlap in some cases. A coroa is a mature older man, regardless of physical appearance or sexual orientation. often admired for his maturity, life experience, financial stability. and/or charisma. and it doesn’t necessarily imply body type or hairiness, or even sexual attractiveness. It’s just a general, harmless, non-sexual descriptor of a mature-looking / -acting older man. Urso is bear in Portuguese. Like in North America, it refers specifically to a gay man who is larger, hairy, and has a rugged or masculine appearance. It’s more about physical traits and being part of that specific urso subculture within the gay community. A man could be both an urso and a coroa if he fits the descriptions of both terms — for instance, a mature, hairy, and rugged older man. And “urso” is used in Brazil far more than “bear” — though you can find more English speakers and global travelers who will use “bear”. Then, there’s “daddy”. A “coroa” can sometimes overlap with the concept of a “daddy” used in North America, but there are differences in connotation. In U.S. gay culture, a “daddy” is typically an older man who is seen as sexually desirable, often confident, nurturing, or protective. The term often carries a playful, flirtatious, or explicitly sexual or dominant undertone, often linked to a power dynamic. The coroa can but may not necessarily be viewed as a daddy — it really depends on the context and the individual’s vibe. While coroa can sometimes imply physical attractiveness (like the term “silver fox” in the USA), it doesn’t inherently carry the sexualized or dominant undertones of “daddy.” It’s important to note (especially in the context of the original post) that. in a country like Brazil with far more (socioeconomic) class delineation between rich and poor than in the USA, Canada or Western Europe, that the coroa and the daddy are almost always the financially stable providers. This is the case whether or not the younger / other partner considers himself a sex worker or not.

That was only because it was closed on its regular Tuesday, due to New Year’s Eve. Call that a “special event”.