Lest We Forget: August 15

[PeterRS]

It has long ago lost its meaning for most, which is more than sad. August 15 marks the formal end of the war in the Pacific. This was the day when the Japanese Emperor spoke to his nation for the first time. I think most of us can remember his talking about how the Japanese people would henceforth have to "endure the unendurable and suffer what is insufferable."

What we forget is that that speech was laden with what today we would call "spin". The declaration of war, proclaimed Hirohito, was "to ensure Japan's self preservation and the stabilisation of East Asia, it being far from our thought either to infringe upon the sovereignty of other nations or to embark upon territorial aggrandisement." Given that Japan had been taking over chunks of China since 1931 and that it then took over a host of countries in Asia, the "infrigement of sovereignty" was clearly a lie.

He then ended that short speech with another lie. "We canot but express our deepest regret to our allied nations of East Asia, who have consistently cooperated with the Empire toward the emancipation of East Asia." "Cooperated with" is aother lie. He talks of four years of war but it was in fact 15 years of war starting in China, the setbacks of the Japanese people and its military forces. Nothing about those slaughtered by Japanese forces. And successive Japanese governments still revere their convicted war dead with annual visits to Tokyo's Yasukuni Shrine.

I have a deep love for Japan as a country and the many Japanese I have met and worked with over decades. But I abhor how that nation is still unable to offer an unequivocal apology for its wartime atrocities. It merely dithers with words like "sorry" and "it must never happen again". It is, I know, part of Japanese culture to be less than clear in many official statements. But the countries of Asia are still awaiting an outright apology for close to 50 million deaths its actions resulted in.   

Some right-wing Japanese still deny that war crimes were ever committed. Arguably the worst of all was the horrendous 1937 Nanjing massacre when Japanese triops murdered 300,000 mostly civilians, an action where babies were torn from their mothers' arms and dashed to the ground and so many tens of thousands of Chinese rounded up and beheaded. One who is not prepared to forget the atrocities in China is President Xi Jinping. August and September will see a host of commemorations including a Parade in Tiananmen Square. Already a video Dead to Rights on the Nanjing massacre has gone viral and a new movie about the lethal medical experiments conducted on Chinese after the invasion of Marchuria opens next month. None will be seen in Japan. South Korea also marks August 15 as gwangbokjeol which translates to the "return of the light."

As Professor Gi-wook Shin of Stanford University points out in a BBC article, collective Japan's basic problem is that in viewing the Pacific War it does so considering it was the victim. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cp89ed9j5ygo

[daydreamer]

Since you mentioned Korea in one sentence, let's not forget another of Emperor Hirohito's evil plans, hatched against the entire Korean peninsula.  During the Japanese annexation and occupation of Korea, that lasted from 1910-1945, the Japanese could have chosen to act responsibly, but instead acted as total barbarians against the Korean people and culture.

The Japanese executed the Korean Queen, forbid spoken and written Korean language, destroyed huge amounts of Korean cultural artifacts, etc.  They exploited Korea's resources for their own profit, starved the people, all Korean rice crops were used for the Japanese only.  They deforested vast areas of Korea, including national forests, and shipped the timber to Japan.

I had a conversation with an older Korean man years ago in South Korea.  I was amazed to learn that he could speak fluent Japanese.  But sadly, he went on to tell me that he was forced to learn Japanese in school as a child, as it was not allowed to speak or write his native Korean language in public or in school.  After talking with him about his childhood years during the Japanese occupation, I began to realize the hardships that Hirohito had imposed on much of Asia during the first half of the 20th century.

Another deplorable chapter in the history of Japan is brought to light in the excellent book entitled Gold Warriors, by Sterling Seagrave.  It chronicles the massive stripping of Asian wealth by the Japanese army, during WWII, commonly known as Yamashita's gold, named after General Yamashita, who carried out the massive and detailed plan.  

In an ironic twist, a large part of the wealth of European countries was sent to their respective Asian colonies just before WWII for safekeeping, to prevent it being plundered by Hiltler's forces.  This made for easy pickings for the Japanese army, as these colonies were invaded and occupied.  Throughout Japanese occupied Asia, bank vaults were emptied of gold bullion.  The Japanese army went door to door, systematically searching each building for anything of value.  Wealth was stolen from temples, museums, jewelry stores, national treasuries, private homes and collections, etc, and it all became the property of Japan.  The amount of stolen treasure was so extensive, that jewels were pried from their settings, sorted by type, and transported in steel oil drums.  Gold was melted and poured into bars, all bearing the mark of imperial Japan.

Although much of the treasure is believed to still be hidden in booby-trapped caves and tunnels in the Philippines, many shiploads of gold and jewels made it to Japan, often on ships disguised with the red cross, to avoid enemy fire in the waters of the Pacific.

Here's a 17 minute video that tells of some of Japan's history with Korea:

 

 

[PeterRS]

Thank you @daydreamer for reminding us all of the evil and slaughter of the Japanese occupation. And it was not only in Korea, but we tend to know much less about that invasion and occupation of the Korean Peninsula.

Two other vital issues we often forget about Korea during WWII. First, Japan realised it did not have sufficient forces to fight on all the war fronts it had opened. So it recruited Koreans. By the end of the war, 5,400,000 Koreans worked for the Japanese war effort. Of these around 650,000 opted to remain in Japan after the war rather than return home to Korea.

The second concerns an agreement made between Roosevelt, Churchill and Stalin at the Yalta Conference in February 1945. This ensured that once the war in Europe was over and the Nazi armies thoroughly defeated, attention would turn to Asia. Korea posed a huge problem as there were more than 850,000 Japanese living in and administering country. These would have to  be vetted for war crimes and the vast majority repatriated. Aware of the massive repatriation  task, this had two immediate consequences. First Russia agreed to declare war on Japan. Second, the US and Russia agreed that they would divide repatriation between them. Russia would take the northern part of the country and the USA the lower, the split being at the 38th parallel. Once the administrative offices had been put in place, of course, America and Russia - allies during the war - became sworn enemies. The failure to put just one country in charge of repatriation then became obvious, and we all know the disaster which has resulted in formation of the two Koreas. What I find extraordinary is that we know by the time of the Yata Conference, although the west needed the Russians to continue fighting Hitler form the east, neither Roosevelt nor Churchill trusted Stalin.  

By 1949, the Americans had left and put in place a pro-American government in the south run by a reviled strongman Syngman Rhee. The Russians removed their forces from the north but not their influence and Kim Il-sung became its strongman. Perhaps ironically the part of Asia which had been most infuenced by Christianity was the Korean Peninsula. Kim Il-sung's material grandfather had been a Protetant minister and it has been alleged that his grandson played the organ in his Church. But like many Koreans Kim was a nationalist whose objective was to get the hated Japanese out of the country. Partisan battles erupted with the Japanese. After one in 1937 the 25-year old Kim fled first to Japanese Manchuria and then to Russia after which he was put on a Japanese 'wanted' list. Many Koreans ended up in Russia where they were able to escape from the hunger, fatigue and danger of fighting in the Peninsula. Kim's first son was born there and named Yuri Irsenovich Kim, later to be known to the world as Kim Jong-il. The Koreans in Russia were then incorporated into the Russia's 88th Special Rifle Brigade. The Russians thereafter persuaded Kim to be their liaison between Pyongyang and the Russian army.

We all know what then happened with the Korean War: its slaughter of millions, the closure of North Korea and in later years the nuclear stand-off. We all conveniently forget that the very fact of partition of the Peninsula was due as much to the west in the form of America and the UK as to Russia.

[Moses]

2 hours ago, PeterRS said:

neither Roosevelt nor Churchill trusted Stalin

Politicians who trust someone are nonsense. As the Snowden case showed, no leader trusts another: otherwise why would Obama eavesdrop on Merkel, Hollande and Cameron?

[PeterRS]

33 minutes ago, Moses said:

Politicians who trust someone are nonsense. As the Snowden case showed, no leader trusts another: otherwise why would Obama eavesdrop on Merkel, Hollande and Cameron?

A totally pointless post, given that in February 1945 the world was in a ghastly war on several fronts. The examples you quote have nothing to do with any war that is underway.

[Riobard]

1 hour ago, PeterRS said:

A totally pointless post, given that in February 1945 the world was in a ghastly war on several fronts. The examples you quote have nothing to do with any war that is underway.

February 1945 is underway? OK then whatevs you say. 

[Moses]

2 hours ago, PeterRS said:

The examples you quote have nothing to do with any war that is underway.

Oh, dear, they for sure have relation. Look on your reaction.

Also I do not wonder what you remind to others about August 15, 1945, but nobody here spoke about August 6 and 8 of 1945. 

[vinapu]

7 hours ago, Moses said:

Politicians who trust someone are nonsense.

 

for obvious reason, todays president, prime minister or king tomorrow  may be dead or crippled and removed from position , replaced by somebody with different ideas

[vinapu]

5 hours ago, Moses said:

 nobody here spoke about August 6 and 8 of 1945. 

Nobody wants to hurt feelings of Russians to remind them to be beaten in race to obtain the Bomb.

[vinapu]

1 minute ago, vinapu said:

Nobody wants to hurt feelings of Russians to remind them to be beaten in race to obtain the Bomb, not to mention joining the war on Japan late only to tear Kurile Islands from her carcass. War is cruel thing to everybody, both those who started it and those attacked. All are victims.

 

[Moses]

3 hours ago, vinapu said:

Nobody wants to hurt feelings of Russians to remind them to be beaten in race to obtain the Bomb.

There was no race: the USSR simply waited for the Americans to do all the preparatory work and stole the plans with the help of the Rosenbergs. They quickly built the bomb and already in 1949 conducted the first test.

And, what is remarkable, once the first in bomb production, the USA is now completely dependent on Russian enriched uranium. The dependence of the US energy industry on this uranium is so high that it was removed from sanctions immediately in the first sanctions package of 2022.

[Moses]

Yeah, it sounds funny, but currently Rosatom ("Russian Atom" state corporation) controls 74% of world construction portfolio of Nuclear Power Plants https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosatom , almost rest amount is in hands of Chinese state corporation. West control is close to zero. 

Of course, these stations became 100% dependable from uranium supply from Russia. 

[vinapu]

reverse of old revolutionists mantra " capitalist will sell you rope  which you later use to hang him on "? 

[PeterRS]

19 hours ago, Moses said:

Politicians who trust someone are nonsense.

Like Stalin who trusted Hitler and then turned on him?

Don't get me wrong, though. Without Russia, the Nazis would have overrun Europe as Churchill and Roosevelt were well aware. I'm not sure why you suddently bring up the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, although they certainly persuaded the Japanese their war had come to an end.

But this thread is about remembrance of the end of the war in the Pacific and particulary the horrific atrocities by the Japanese in that war. Not about who is winning a present day arms race. You are certainly free to start another thread should you so wish.

[Moses]

3 hours ago, PeterRS said:

I'm not sure why you suddently bring up the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Because each bombing - August 6 and August 8 - brought more victims to the world than the Nanjing Massacre. Because the US has not yet apologized for these bombings, even at the level of Japan's apology for the Nanjing Massacre.

[PeterRS]

2 minutes ago, Moses said:

Because each bombing - August 6 and August 8 - brought more victims to the world than the Nanjing Massacre. Because the US has not yet apologized for these bombings, even at the level of Japan's apology for the Nanjing Massacre.

Another of your non-facts which is untrue. Less than 300,000 in total were killed in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The statistic site has a wide estimte of between 110,000 and 210,000 deaths. Others agree with the higher end -

https://www.britannica.com/question/How-many-people-died-in-the-bombings-of-Hiroshima-and-Nagasaki

https://www.newsweek.com/how-many-people-died-hiroshima-nagasaki-japan-second-world-war-1522276

[Moses]

19 minutes ago, PeterRS said:

Another of your non-facts which is untrue. Less than 300,000 in total were killed in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The statistic site has a wide estimte of between 110,000 and 210,000 deaths. Others agree with the higher end -

https://www.britannica.com/question/How-many-people-died-in-the-bombings-of-Hiroshima-and-Nagasaki

https://www.newsweek.com/how-many-people-died-hiroshima-nagasaki-japan-second-world-war-1522276

That's clear bullshit and western propaganda. As of Feb 2025, the Hiroshima survivor memorial register holds 339,227 names of confirmed victims.

https://www.city.hiroshima.lg.jp/shisei/toukei/1006109/1027849/1027850/1017156.html

P.S. Oh, I see. I wrote "each". It is wrong. there should be "together".

[vinapu]

9 hours ago, Moses said:

 As of Feb 2025, the Hiroshima survivor memorial register holds 339,227 names of confirmed victims.

 

that's the sad loss of Japanese life  as result of  the war Japan started.

I'm inclined more about worrying about loss  of Russian life  as result of recent war Russia started and I'm not even Russian. 

[floridarob]

If you listen to Trump, Biden started that war, and the Red Hats believe him  🙄

[vinapu]

1 hour ago, floridarob said:

If you listen to Trump, Biden started that war, and the Red Hats believe him  🙄

I heard him saying 'this is Binden's war, not mine " and thought to myself " how lucky I'm that he's not my president 

[Moses]

3 hours ago, vinapu said:

that's the sad loss of Japanese life  as result of  the war Japan started.

No, this "sad loss" is the result of the barbaric American nuclear bombing of the civilian population of Japanese cities. And, what is remarkable, even those historians who claim that this bombing accelerated the capitulation of Japan do not go further and do not dare to claim that it was necessary and inevitable.

Since then, the United States is the only country in the world that has used a nuclear bomb on a civilian population to establish itself as the world's policeman.

[Moses]

4 hours ago, vinapu said:

I'm inclined more about worrying about loss  of Russian life  as result of recent war Russia started and I'm not even Russian. 

And I don't worry about them: since there is no forced mobilization in Russia, and all the fighters voluntarily went to the conflict zone and signed a contract, I consider it their personal business. They went there knowing the risks, the amount of compensation, insurance and privileges that await them at the end of the contract.

Who makes sense to worry about - the Ukrainians forcibly driven by the Zelensky regime - they have no choice. In Ukraine, there is forced mobilization, since there are not enough idiots to die for the Zelensky regime, fanatics are a few percent, the rest are driven to the front by force.

But Ukraine had the opportunity to avoid this after the conflict began - at the peace talks in Istanbul in the spring of 2022. This could have saved the lives of hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians.

[vinapu]

14 hours ago, Moses said:

That's clear bullshit and western propaganda.

that was then

and now sample  of clear bullshit and Russian  propaganda

24 minutes ago, Moses said:

And I don't worry about them: since there is no forced mobilization in Russia, and all the fighters voluntarily went to the conflict zone and signed a contract, I consider it their personal business. They went there knowing the risks, the amount of compensation, insurance and privileges that await them at the end of the contract.

Who makes sense to worry about - the Ukrainians forcibly driven by the Zelensky regime - they have no choice. In Ukraine, there is forced mobilization, since there are not enough idiots to die for the Zelensky regime, fanatics are a few percent, the rest are driven to the front by force.

But Ukraine had the opportunity to avoid this after the conflict began - at the peace talks in Istanbul in the spring of 2022. This could have saved the lives of hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians.

this is not conflict, it's war of aggression starter by Russia. Would you or anybody there  dare to say " on Jun 22 -1941 German -Russian conflict began" ? 

Great Patriotic Conflict sounds immensely  more shallow that Great Patriotic War, no? 

[PeterRS]

I think a new thread for Ukraine is called for. There have been valid points made about WWII which I di not believe are associated with Ukraine. So I'll start one!

[PeterRS]

21 hours ago, Moses said:

That's clear bullshit and western propaganda.

Typical @Moses response. But I agree that if you take the lifespan of the atomic bomb survivors the number is certainly over 300,000. Even in the 1980s, though, the numbers who died as a direct result of the atomic bombs was regarded by all, including the Japanese, as less than 300,000. It is only more recently that those who suffered delayed cancers and other results of the bombings have been taken into account - and rightly so in my view.

Yet arguing over numbers of dead in two clear massacres - first in Nanjing and secondly in Hiroshima and Nagasaki - is surely pointless. Both were the ghastly results of war. And in war, both sides resort to desperate measures to win. The difference between Nanjing and the two Japanese cities is that Nanjing had very little to do with the war other than it was Chiang Kai Shek's capital. It was pure barbarity on a huge scale as most of those killed were civilians and the outcome had little impact on any war the Japanese were fighting at the time.

Fast forward to 1945 and Japan knew it was on its knees. There are natually opposing camps. The one taught in American schools is that an invasion of the Japanese mainland would quite literally be fought until the last Japanese fell. Thus the bombs shortened the war and resulted in hundreds of thousands of American lives being saved. The other, frequently taght in Japan, is that the bombs were dropped as geopolitical calculation to keep advancing Russia at bay.

Russian forces had after all entered the Pacific War and were advancing towards northern Japan. Stalin had ended Russia's neutrality pact with Japan in April and was massing troops towards Japanese held territory. Delaying the end of the war was therefore in its interests. Russia after all invaded Japanese-held Manchuria the same day as the bomb was dropped on Nagasaki. As this view goes, the USA was determined both to put an end to the war and prevent Russian troops from advancing further. Yet still the Russian troops continued their advance through September until the Americans quickly occupied Japan's main islands. The Russians then pulled back.