hank75

I’ve had this arrangement before. The bar permitted it as more boys on stage meant attracting more customers, but they were far from thrilled. My guy asked me every now and then to go into the bar for drinks to demonstrate he was still bringing in income. Naturally this included tips to mamasan and bar manager to keep them happy. He ostensibly took offs to drink with customers at other bars, DJ or GOD, or when invited for karaoke. So he wasn’t entirely off-less. This was of course a slippery slope and descent into the sheer madness of trying to unpick truth from lies. I do believe for what it’s worth he did enter into this arrangement in good faith and tried to maintain his end of the bargain…for a while. I have mixed feelings about this kind of arrangement. It’s the most logical set up as it prevents the boy from getting bored and lets him earn some side income. But the level of trust has to be off the charts and I wouldn’t recommend it for the heartache it can cause when it inevitably fails.

I’m not suggesting Jimmie himself breaks the law. If the boys themselves want to take the risk that’s entirely up to them. I know many who do, and pay coffee money when checked. This is also how they cross the land borders. Not a single boy that I know of has ever been to Bangkok Hilton. Nor a farang for being with an overstaying money boy. It’s not illegal either to simply be in the presence of an overstayer.

During Covid when travel closed I was bored out of my mind, had many business related worries, and formed an online friendship with an ex bar boy who had gotten trapped in his home country, and was struggling to eke out a pittance. His daily calls and messages helped me tide over a difficult period. I sent him around $200-300 each month to keep him afloat. I saw this as him providing similar services just remotely. Helping him also helped me to get out of my own head during lockdown. We didn’t indulge in video sex because he had roommates but I certainly enjoyed the video calls when he had just gotten out of the shower. If you are inclined to send Cam money during the months you are not together (seems like you are) it should only be as a reward for effort and proportionate to the effort he’s putting in. Don’t get carried away just because you’re infatuated and never send him free money.

Please don’t scare @jimmie50. I know several Cambodian overstayers and apart from the usual police shakedown they’re merrily continuing with life as usual. Their landlords have not flushed them out, their rooms (right smack in bar district) don’t get raided, they travel between Bangkok and Pattaya just fine. Nothing some coffee money won’t fix. If he has an ID card or a photo of his passport on his phone, he can be registered as the second guest in a hotel. I travelled to Pattaya in February with my guy who back then had ambiguous visa status and no passport. Zero issues.

I don’t know if this is at all helpful but Nut, the Moonlight model is an actual muay thai instructor which his day job

This is quite simply a brilliant idea that never occured to me. I’ve always admired Rimowa’s sleek design without wanting to pay the associated price tag, all the more since I’ve heard from friends that the newer lines of Rimowa are just as easily damaged as cheaper brands. Do you by any chance remember which shop this was?

Pleas for help are all too common or, if you have been unlucky like me as a newbie, outright demands and manipulation. The true gems are those who never ask. My current guy has never asked me once for money nor to buy him any items that are not absolutely essential. (Most recently, underwear. He was down to two holey pairs and constantly rewashing them in the shower and draping them all over the hotel furniture until I caught on) I strongly suggest you do not start these “emergency money” discussions with him as it opens the door to requests. I would also recommend reconsidering any relationship that came with requests for money before you have established a proper understanding and your 3 months. At this stage you have spent a paltry 7 days together. He has zero right to your money when he is not working as your paid companion. If he maintains contact for several months, keeps you happy, entertained, and loneliness at bay, you could perhaps then consider a tip for this long distance “work”. After your year end trip, you can decide if the relationship has evolved sufficiently for a relaxation of financial terms.

I am still reading through your responses so posting my thoughts as I go along. 3 days for 10,000 is extremely fair, underpaid even (in my book, other members may disagree). 4-5k per day would be more in line for non stop companionship. 25k for a week is spot on, factoring in long term discount. Does this sound contradictory? Not exactly. 3000 for a full day and night feels little considering they could have made 3000 at the bar just for the night shift. However a guaranteed 25k in a week doesn’t come their way often and discounts are de facto, the longer the off. And since it appears you are new to this, please don’t assume it should then be 25k x 4 for a month.

Have you clarified with him where his passport is at? It is only recently after Thai-Cambodian skirmishes that the status for Cambodian guys has become awkward. Prior to that all boys were able to enter Thailand legally with a 30 or 60 day visa in their passport and with this visa they were able to collect Western Union. Many Cambodians boys (at least all that I know) have Thai bank accounts though it was easier for those who started working some years ago, maybe not new arrivals. I have sent money twice to “middlemen”. One to a Cambodian with a Thai bank account who then sent the money on to the boy’s mother in Cambodia. The second time to one who picked up cash in Cambodia. Both times the money arrived safely. I assume there was a small fee. Cam can ask around to locate such middlemen if he doesn’t know one already. Otherwise you can send money to a bar friend of Cam’s which is common. Don’t send large amounts as Cam will have to offer a tip for the help.

Please excuse me if this sounds blunt. In all honesty, this is excessive. I have never heard of paying an off fee for months on end. When I make arrangements to meet boys outside the bar, whether for several days or lengthy durations I have never paid off fee to the bar nor worried about it. I pay the boy, the boy settles the bar in his own way. It is very common for boys to take long leaves of absence or just blissfully vanish then reappear. They are never barred from returning to work. Bars need boys, especially popular boys, to stay in business. Don’t make the mistake of trying to do his job for him. Your job is to pay Cam the agreed stipend. Let him talk to his friends who may have been in similar situations and find the solution. Being able to keep more money for his farm and family will be a great motivator. What is the longest time he has been booked out from the bar before, and how did he handle it? Yes, I’ve taken boys on trips and they did not post pictures on their social media as that would conflict with their “buffalo sick and half dead also my grandmother” stories. The acceptable compromise is for Cam to work out his solution with the bar, and for both of you to occasionally drop by and support the bar by having drinks and tipping mamasan. Appropriate to also pay Cam’s off fee on these occasions. Everyone will be happy.

Or the tricks they get up to using video calls to make sponsors think they are faithful and living like nuns 🤣

all to personal preference

I am hoping that by sharing a few thoughts here @jimmie50 may be spared some of the bumps in the road I’ve encountered! Boy-shaped bumps.

I think you are attaching too much importance to numbers. It’s not like a football player’s lucky jersey and if he really wants to keep the number, he can inform the bar he will be back and tip the manager to keep the number for him. Most boys would prefer 3 paid months with a favorite customer / potential boyfriend than a number tag. If you are planning to keep him with you for 3 months, you need to have this conversation with him anyway, about what amount he expects in order to compensate him for his bar earnings. How he handles this conversation will give you an inkling as to his expectations for the future so it is better known early than late. Don’t rush into it, plan what questions you will ask, and work out ahead of time what you feel a reasonable amount would be so you have a mental guideline in place which can be adjusted based on the discussion. The worst is to initiate the conversation cluelessly, without doing your own research and let the boy set the all the terms. Renegotiating will be harder than the first open and frank discussion. If I’m not incorrect, you also seem to be under the impression you need to pay him a daily rate similar to what he earns at the bar each day (inclusive of off fee) but actually weekly or monthly arrangements with long term discount is not unusual at all.

My view is that it’s best to agree a fixed amount with Cam on a monthly or weekly basis, and let him sort things out with the bar to take a leave of absence. Boys often leave work for several months when they’ve found a long term customer or sponsor. Many just claim a family emergency and say “going home” then rejoin the bar again some months later. Discuss it with Cam. I’m sure he’d prefer you to spend that money on him than the bar.

I am unsure. I believe he doesn’t know full details or chooses to turn a blind eye, but surely he suspects. This arrangement seems to work for both. The boyfriend is grateful for financial support. The farang (who is getting on in years as you have correctly guessed) has a strapping muscular guy who by all accounts takes very good care of him and lives with him when he visits. Zero judgement from me. It just wouldn’t work for me. I did wonder why he didn’t find a strapping gay guy who could provide a more authentic boyfriend experience but only the involved parties will know the true situation.

This is an important detail. I know an ex boy in a boyfriend situation with an older farang who supports him. It is a very stable relationship, both are happy, the boy is loyal and looks after his sponsor well. The catch is, he is straight and also lives with his wife and infant children when his sponsor is out of Thailand. I do not think I could undertake a relationship (paid or emotional) under those circumstances. I will DM you on longer term accommodation around Silom.

I just arrived in Bangkok on Friday (for work so nothing to report). The immigration queue was one of the longest I have ever seen.Speaking to the gentleman in the line ahead of me, appears flights from Middle East have now started running again after several days delay, which is causing a high volume of arrivals. This gentleman came from Sweden via a transit in Dubai on Emirates. He said he was rebooked from his original flight with a delay of 3 days. The immigration staff were flustered which made them curt, unhelpful and bordering on rude. Huge confusion over who was allowed to use the priority lane. Many queue jumpers tried to get into priority. After seeing the queue I initially regretted not booking the AOT express service. But after a while they gave up filtering passengers and just waved everyone into the priority lane to ease the massive queue. Passengers in wheelchairs or accompanied by the AOT butler were forced right to the back. There was outright discrimination, a young guy who was clearly poor and badly educated had a badly booked transit which required him to exit immigration, collect his bags and then re-check in. He didn’t know if he should go through the regular immigration channels, go through transit or how to complete TDAC which requires stating length of stay and accommodation. We all witnessed immigration staff shouting at him, hustling him back into the queue without listening and refusing to provide any clarity on his situation. He was almost in tears thinking he would miss his next flight. Swedish gentleman and another Asian gentleman banded together to help him out and he was finally escorted through. To be fair, they tried to keep things moving at a snappy pace although it still took an hour. I booked an airport pick up after hearing about taxi fuel shortages at Suvarnabhumi and my pick up has to call to find out if I was coming because I was so late. I wasn’t worried about not actually being able to get a taxi for a ride into central Bangkok, but was concerned the taxi line might be extremely long. After facing down the immigration line I was glad to jump straight into my pick up. For anyone arriving between now and Songkran, do have your TDAC and other necessary documents ready, and book advance transport.

You are right. I am ageing. Was typing while on a plane and skipped my morning coffee and somehow I managed to mix Songkran up with Tet. Applogies to OP. I still think an extended Thai holiday is more enjoyable than splitting off to HCM edit: just discovered it’s not possible to edit old posts, even to remove factual inaccuracies? I shall in the future desist from posting when I’m functioning on minimal sleep, no caffeine and bored in the airport

I believe the panic over jet fuel in Vietnam has subsided and there is government commitment to keeping state airlines running. Travel insurance is a must. That said I’m in agreement to cut your losses and do an extended Thailand trip. You’ve cancelled the two more enjoyable cities (Hanoi and Danang). HCM isn’t that enjoyable by comparison and five nights is a very long time for that city. You are also going right before Tet. Traffic is usually terrible and there may be some closures as people try to go back to their hometowns early due to fuel shortages. Look up Vietnam travel forums for more accurate news but I found this post (in reference to Tet 2026 but before the war started) Visiting HCMC right before Tet is definitely an interesting time, and your concern about shops closing down is valid. Many local, family-run businesses, especially smaller shops and street food vendors, will indeed start closing a few days before Tet to prepare for the holiday and travel back to their hometowns. This means that the vibrant street life you might expect for casual eating and shopping could be noticeably quieter in many areas. Major shopping malls and larger supermarkets will likely remain open longer, possibly with reduced hours as Tet approaches, but the atmosphere will be very focused on holiday preparations rather than regular commerce. Dining can also become a bit trickier, as many local eateries will be closed. However, there are still options, especially in tourist-focused areas or larger hotels, but you might need to be more intentional about where you go. If you're looking to still experience the food scene or find specific shopping experiences, sometimes looking into pre-arranged activities can be helpful during this period. You might find services that specifically cater to visitors during the Tet period, like food tours or private shopping experiences with local guides who know what's open. Platforms like Viator are often used to find and book various tours and activities, and they list operators with reviews, which can give you confidence in what you're booking, especially when many local businesses are winding down. It's really about managing expectations and being prepared for a different kind of HCMC experience. God bless. Unless you’re thoroughly bored of Thailand there are so many great cities to explore and if you don’t want to fly, Pattaya and Koh Samet are a great combination.

It’s a very special hotel that only Olddady can reside at, TART-awan

In preparation for Songkran, Moonlight has theirs models dancing along Silom Road and parading down Thaniya and the BTS steps. Some new faces (one guy has an attractive smile and even more attractive body), many old ones. Babe still managing to cling on to his position as the star. Nicky visibly thicker around the middle. No Joey. Videos can be viewed on Facebook.

With your love of Vietnam guys, why do you not go directly to Vietnam especially since I’m sure you may know some boys who have retired back there? Genuinely curious.

sex shit and shower?

I only go out in Bangkok. At home especially on weekdays I try to be home, eat and sleep as early as possible. In Bangkok if I have company whether personal friends or a boy, I time my evening to have dinner, a drink somewhere maybe Soi 4, and then a bar in time for the show. I enjoy people watching. If I’m alone I have something light at or near the hotel. If I’m at Le Meridien I cobble together a meal at the lounge. It gets harder and harder with every passing year to not simply fall asleep and instead shower and dress for the bars. I often give in to temptation and just Line a regular boy to come over from his bar. If it’s a non-bar night but I have a boy with me, I enjoy going somewhere like mookata, so he can order in Thai and I get a local experience that I couldn’t have on my own. Bonus: it’s often a buffet so boy can eat his heart out without damage to my pocket. The best places often have a massive queue so we start early, at 5.30 or 6 pm. That leaves plenty of time at night for fun and the mookata reek means showering together is compulsory. A win-win.