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Please try the other apps, Hornet and Heesay (formerly Blued) - especially when in remote areas. These 2 apps tend to appeal to the Thai-for-Thai segment. But, many of these can also be persuaded to play with us foreigners - especially if you are willing to use a translation tool. Heesay has one built directly into the app. Grindr tends to be more popular in the larger urban areas where the escorts intentionally want to make contact with foreigners.

Excellent observation. I will further add, that when they are gay - it starts to get more into the areas of: who are you dating?, why are you paying for MBs?, why are you single? for me - this is too much drama - just let us keep it fun without too much deviation from what was agreed to. If we agree to see each other many more times - then I might be willing to answer the above questions. Straight or bi guys just don't care and I never feel like there has been an invasion of privacy - especially for this type of transaction.

GREAT idea @Moses - I did exactly this trip with Woody and his partner Non - back in 2015 before Woody became a Siam Roads associate. https://siamroads.com/woody-chiang-mai/ It was one of my BEST trips ever in Thailand and to sleep in those floating villas was truly peaceful and amazing.

@Foolish, please add X-Boys Pattaya to this list https://www.xboyspattaya.com/x-boys/ They have live sex show and their guys can be offed - but I do not know what the current off fee is.

Very sad day today. So, I wake up this morning to go to the gym but before leaving the condo complex I show the security team the article from a Thai news source. https://news1live.com/detail/9670000088988 They confirm to me that it was in fact our condo building and they tell me the following additional facts: Italian man, 19th floor - parking lot side of the building They seemed reluctant to reveal any more information to me when I pushed them so I backed off. Then I went to the outside parking lot to see the damaged car which was hit by the naked Italian's falling body. It had rained heavily last night - so any gore or blood residue was already washed away. I then looked up to see if I could locate the 19th floor balcony Then I walked to my gym and I cried most of the way. I do not believe that I know this Italian - but you never know, as Jomtien is a small village - especially for us who live here year round. I sent via LINE the above article to my Thai gym trainer just seconds before I entered into the gym. They saw that I was quite upset and I asked them if they knew what happened. My gym trainer did not, but the gym manager did, as she has a friend who lives in the same building. She was able to give me one additional detail: This Italian man was 57 years old. Nobody (gym people or my security team) could explain why this Italian man was naked. I lived and worked in Italy for 12 years and it is not normal for Italian people to be naked - as this might bring about more shame to an already difficult event. Complete gym workout and then went to breakfast and I wrote to my ex - as he owns a bar in the Jomtien Complex to ask him if he knows anything and unfortunately he does not. Returned home and I chatted via LINE with my realty lady and she told me that she did know this Italian guy and the only additional detail that she could share with me was that this Italian man was very sick. However, this still does not explain why he was completely naked. Now they are towing the damaged car away as it seems that the police have finished their investigation. I do not know which condo neighbor's car was damaged. This entire event has made me melancholy, depressed, and reflective of an excellent post that our @Olddaddy wrote in this forum on 29 July 2022: I normally do not go out in the night when I have my gym training the next day (wake up at 6:15am) - but I told my Thai friend that I need to not be alone tonight and for us to go do something fun to get my mind off of this morbid event. This poor Italian guy lived on the next higher floor from me - so close to where my condo room is - just the idea of sitting on your balcony and a human body flies by to his death is just upsetting me soo much. Thank GOD that I did not witness this event. I apologize to all of you to be so down today - as most of you who know me know that I am normally always positive and happy - but this PFC event is too close to home to just shrug it off....

The ending is great when "she" needs to be butch and masculine to respond to that phone call 🤣

I just measured it now - 120 cm - so almost 4 feet. That is pretty high - I would need to make a big effort to overcome it. Excuse the tacky rainbow colored windmill. I have them on all of the balcony poles as they help to scare the BIG birds away that like to come and poop on the balcony.

I did not know this. I find this amazing. Is this why I have such an affinity for Vietnam ? Do you know where Thai people originally come from? How long have they been in Thailand? Where were they before that? The Thai people originated from Vietnam, where there are still original Thai people. Basically the Thai, Zhuang, Dai, Tay, Nung,Lao and Vietnamese people are all basically Kra-dai people, they may speak slightly different languages due to historical factors (influenced by China or India). The Thai people then moved south and were influenced by Indian culture, they mixed with the natives and became the Thailand people today. Thailand people also welcomed the wave of Chinese immigrants from China in the past. DNA: Thai_Vietnam people are the indigenous Thai people of Vietnam. Basically Thai_Vietnam people can understand Thailand's and Laos language. Thai_Vietnam: Thai stilt house in Vietnam: Thailand people: Source: https://www.quora.com/ Eastern Laos Legend Follow Studied at Hanoi University of Science and Technology Sep 12

Wow @reader from the photos in that article, it looks like the same condo building where I live. It must have happened last night ? I was not aware of anything. When I came home today after the gym and to see the testosterone doctor - I saw the police in the security room looking at the CCTV footage. So, now the Pattaya Flying Club is too close to home..... I will ask the security team tomorrow if they know what happened....

The BOT (Bank of Thailand) will eventually lower their interest rates. Why? Thai exports have become more expensive. In bound tourists will have less money to spend due to the higher baht. The nearby Chinese economy seems to be in trouble. We have seen this global rate cut cycle repeat itself so many times in the past. https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/general/2870433/all-eyes-on-the-baht

hmm, difficult question to respond to. They are predominately gay, there are some bi, and there are also sometimes a few transgender - which I discovered when way back in March, as reported by @reader, when he posted the Filipino - and Thai transgender clash on Sukhumvit soi 11 in Bangkok. because at one of the volleyball games, a Filipina transgender asked if she could join the volleyball guys one evening in March and she specifically referred to what had just happened in Bangkok on Soi Sukhumvit 11. The guys all laughed and told her if she would be a "good girl" then no harm would come to her.... They loved her and she had a great time. Kudos for Thai peace and good Philippine behavior. There are also some straight - and they tend to be from the Russian contingent that sometimes joins the Thai guys to play volleyball. Some of the straight Russian guys are pretty cool about all of the slurs, cat-calling, and lusty eyes on them, etcetra. The ring leader of this "gay volleyball" - Ma Toey, a gay Thai guy, is very brazen with everyone. In fact, one night after volleyball some of us went to the nearby Russian night market in Prathumnak to eat dinner and drink. Well, Ma Toey, was obsessed with one of these straight Russian guys and made sure that he was well drunk by the end of the night and rumor says that Ma Toey was able to get into this straight Russian's hotel room at the nearby Pattaya Park Tower, and he gave him a blow job. so, are they all available, if all goes well? I would say that it is hit and miss for various reasons: 1.) Some of them are money boys - as they don't have day jobs and playing volleyball at night does not pay the bills. This sub-set of volleyball guys tend to have their profiles in Hornet. Supposedly, not everyone knows about each others ways on how they get money. But if you are subtle with them in a discreet way you can become one of their customers for payment. I have gone with about 4 of them. One of these four, swore me to secrecy because he did not want the other volleyball guys to know that he was an escort - you cannot tell from his Hornet profile - but I pursued him because I got to know him at volleyball and when I discovered his Hornet profile I wrote to him. 2.) Some of them are NOT money boys and have daytime jobs and join volleyball in the evening after finishing work. This sub-set is not as easy to have sex with because they have jobs and are more picky about who they will have sex with and might be offended at the idea of being paid for sex. There is one guy in this sub-set that I had the hots for and I knew his former boyfriend and I asked his former boyfriend if it would be possible to get his ex in my bed - obviously for payment. So, my volleyball friend arranged that the 3 of us went to dinner one night so that I could get to know him outside of on the volleyball field - more discrete. We exchanged our LINE contacts and in the following days I solicited him for some fun in my bed. All of the pricing details were worked out - but this guy had so many - "you cannot do these things to me:" 1.) not to suck his cock without a condom, 2.) not to touch his nipples - he is too ticklish, 3.) no kissing, 4.) does not like edging or to receive a handjob, 5.) do not touch or caress his balls, 6.) he did not want to reciprocate anything back to me. So, I did not pursue him anymore but we are still cordial at volleyball and he knows that if he would loosen up his crazy restrictions that I am still game. When my volleyball friend asked me if we had met - I told him about all of the above restrictions and said that it killed my interest. I then asked my volleyball friend - why did you stay with him for 4 years? He replied to me, He is an excellent top with a humongous dick and can fuck me all night long. Since I am not a bottom and I am predominantly an edger - I could then understand why it would never work for me - even though I became obsessed to want to play with his humongous dick. 3.) People passing by on the Dongtan sidewalk at the volleyball field who stop to: 1.) watch, or 2.) play. One of these guys (a tourist) who was watching I managed to get into my bed. On another occasion, there were 3 Japanese tourists who stopped to play and I was goo-goo gaa-gaa for all of them and I made them know that I was interested. They left during the volleyball game (as the Thai guys kicked their ass) to go eat and said that they would return and that we could discuss this more. Unfortunately, they never returned and I remained on the volleyball field well after everyone else left - oh well - you cannot have everything. 4.) Random - I have witnessed random volleyball guys hooking up with other players and other spectators. I was not close enough to them to understand how it happened - but it happened. So, anything is possible. If you do not get laid - you will still have fun, be entertained, and possibly make new friends. Once you can get into the inner circle - options for sex become much more easier.

@vinapu I believe that Vinapu is referring to either the Pattaya Number One OR Foxy Smile massage shops - which are adjacent to the very delicious O Delices French bakery. https://www.gaysupertown.com/massage

Short answer is YES. But note the following: There are 2 types of guys who work in these bars, employees of the bar (EoB), freelancers. The EoB will be more restricted to be offed by you as he needs to fulfill the contractual obligations of his work contract. If the bar is not busy and his role is not critical (showguy), then most likely the management would allow him to be offed by you prior to the bar closing time. On the other hand, as the freelancers are not on a contract with said bar and do not receive a salary - they are much more free to come and go as they please. Not 100% of the guys are willing to be offed. My guess is that at least 80% are. I do not know for sure. Then each bar has an off-fee which I believe can be from 300 baht to 500 baht - depending on the bar. Please note that @vinapu recently reported that offing a guy from BoyzBoyzBoyz in Boyztown is now up to the high price of 1050 baht. Can the off fees be avoided? YES, but it will take some work on your part - easier if you live here already. Follow the guys in the apps (Grindr, Hornet, Heesay, PlanetRomeo) - if you see one of your desired bar guys online when you are feeling horny, you can solicit him outside of the bar via the app. This does not always work - as I solicited a muscle guy who used to work outside of BoyzBoyzBoyz (BBB) - he had a dual job - 1.) to be a barker and try to get passersby to go into BBB, 2.) to be a waiter to those customers who sit outside of BBB to have a drink. We had too much fun in the late afternoon and he arrived late to BBB and got into trouble with his boss = oops.... He has since moved on and is now working at the M2M cabaret bar in the Jomtien Supertown Complex - but just last Friday he told me that he will go back to Boyztown and work in the Ambiance and also moonlight sometimes at M2M - but he can easily be found in Hornet if you like muscles.

Yes, this is the LTR (Long Term Resident) visa with the Wealthy Pensioners option. Unfortunately I do not qualify - as you need to show proof of $80,000 USD in passive income in each of the 2 preceding tax years before applying. That is $6,666.66 USD per month and I won't reach that threshold until my age 67, when my USA social security will start. But I would not be eligible for this LTR until my age 69 - as you need to show 2 preceding tax years of meeting the $80,000 USD passive income. This tax free option truly discriminates against us foreigners (expats) who cannot prove a passive income of $80,000 USD - and consequently we are subject to this new Thailand taxation scheme. So, tax the relatively "poor" and do not tax the wealthy pensioners - I just cannot get my head around who created this type of system ?

No. I will already need to start my 4-4-4 tax minimalization plan to not exceed the number of days that I live in Thailand by 180 days. In January and part of February, I am planning to be in The Philippines (probably Cebu City). Then back to Thailand for the remainder of February and March to prepare my USA income tax return 🤢🤮 and get it shipped (stamped) from my bonafide declared residence country. Then in April - get out of Thailand before the madness of the water squirting bazooka gun festival of Songkran starts. I will try to live in Da Nang, Vietnam for 4 or 5 months. Then I believe that it should be safe for me to return to Thailand from a tax point of view. Unless of course, the Thai government rescinds this new tax scheme, as many important hi-so people in the Thai real estate business are very upset with this new Thai government - as external investors are now afraid to invest in Thailand in fear of these new tax schemes, and this is already hurting the real estate industry. 🤞🤞🤞

Sit on the bamboo logs (they are bundled together to make like a bench seat) that are perpendicular to the volleyball net at the pedestrian sidewalk. Then do like I did - yell and scream like a chearleader when they are playing - especially if it is a good volley. That will get them focused on you because they love the attention. Eventually one team will win and some of the guys will come towards the bamboo bench (where you have strategically placed yourself) and they will be thirsty. So, that is your moment to strike up a conversation. Say: Wow - great match - great game Want some beers? Wine? I offer. Where can we buy them? Then they will start talking in Thai to the other guys and 1 of 2 things will happen: 1.) One of the guys will be delegated the task of driving you over to the nearby 7-Eleven on their motorbike for the shopping expedition. Be prepared to spend 1.000 to 1.500 baht on beer, wine, snacks, and ice. 2.) If they are shy (to bring you on their motorbike) they may ask you directly for the money and one of them will go to the nearby 7-Eleven to do the shopping. Option 1 is the best in my opinion as it gets you inside their inner circle. After the shopping is done - you will be invited to drink with them. Now you will have a new group of happy crazy good fun athletic Thai guys as your new friends. How do I know all of this? I saw the above plan play out by a Russian guy. So, when the Russian guy was not there one night, I tried it and it worked. So, I am a copycat.

I've already fantasized a lot about this opportunity. I will finish with my gym trainer here in Pattaya at the end of November. So, in December, I hope to return to BKK specifically to organize a 4 hands massage with OLE and JJ. That will be my "prize" before I start my 4-4-4 plan to live outside of Thailand for more than 180 days in year 2025. But, maybe there are JJs and OLEs to discover in The Philippines and in Vietnam 🤔😜😛😋🍆💦 next year 🤞🙏😇

@Olddaddy don't forget to visit the gay volleyball at night (from 5:30 pm until 10 pm) at Dongtan beach in front of Pattaya Tower (water park) right next to the Sea Rescue site. There can be some good eye candy there. And if you offer to buy the guys some wine or beer you will be a big star. Often after volleyball they go to eat and drink in either: Panorama Bar in Boyztown, or, Soi 12 (Jomtien) to sit on the beach and drink. Many ways to get 1 or 2 for "take away" 😜😛😋🍆💦

And if you live here you do not want to even look at your bank statement 🥴 🤧 😱

Sure - gladly. But, realize that the snacks that our Thai guys prefer are not usually the ones that us farangs tend to prefer - and that is mostly because (in my humble opinion) due to the spiciness level that the Thais desire in their food and also in their snacks. So, when you are in 7-Eleven buy any snack that has a spicy symbol or chili symbol on it and most likely you cannot go wrong. I was able to discover what they like when I started going to the Dongtan gay beach volleyball games and we would go to 7-Eleven to pick up some beers, wine, ice, and snacks for the nighttime games and I started to see a particular pattern for certain spicy snacks. My 7-Eleven snack shelf in my kitchen From the above, the most popular are shown below and the roasted pistachios should also be considered (I have never see the pistachios offered with a spicy version😞 Let us know if you can tolerate the spiciness level of these snacks ? 🤔

He is good because he is Thai. The Thai guys know where all of the hidden - out of sight guys are lurking. For example, MANY Thai guys told me that they intentionally avoid PlanetRomeo and Grindr - because they do not feel comfortable marketing to us farangs (foreigners) - for various reasons - language deficiency, do not like farangs, etcetra. Also, this guy works in Supertown and is also friends with BOTH the Dongtan gay volleyball group as well as the Jomtien soi 12 drink the night away on the beach sand after all of the bars have closed - so he has access to an overabundance of new fresh guys for us to play with. When I go out with him (outside of the bedroom) I see that many, many, guys have an affinity to him - so, he is just a natural at convincing guys to play/massage an old farang like me. Also, since we do these 4 hands in my condo room - I try to create an environment that is ultra friendly to these shy Thai guys that may have never been with a farang before. I do the following: put on Thai music - Youtube Thai top hits - that already puts them at ease as they see that this farang likes their music and culture, if they are super nervous, we go out on the balcony and look at the sea and have something to drink before we start the massage, I already have my bed ready for the massage and action and I have already pre-bought my favorite massage creams and edging lotion, they can use my shower both before and after, often after everything is done - they either leave in a hurry - especially if they work in one of the nearby bars and Mr. Boss may be looking for them, OR - we again sit out on the balcony and have a beer or 2. I also have a shelf in my kitchen that is full of Thai specialty snacks that I buy from 7-Eleven - my guys call that shelf my "private 7" and they are ALWAYS offered a snack to enjoy while in my condo or for take away. my main massage guy tells me that with all of the above I have created a lot of good-will (jai-dee) and our guys do gossip about us - so, I appreciate that I have this positive karma in the local community.

I know that this question is not for me - but 85% to 90% of the time they understand when they see your boner. if because you are nervous during the massage and you are not fully erect yet - you can: make your semi hard dick jump underneath the towel to get the masseurs attention, make sensual subtle groaning noises whenever his hands are near your groin, balls, or belly button, or if you are feeling brave - you can just grab his hand and put it on your cock - worst he can do is say no - but sometimes that no is artificial because it was not said with a number (i.e. 500 baht, 1,000 baht, etc.).

Back when I lived in Rome, Italy - I hooked up with some other Italian gay guys who were renting illegally constructed houses that were on the hills outside of Itri - more towards the gay beaches of Gaeta. We were able to get these great homes for such a cheap price for the entire summer beach season. I remember that when we had to pay the rent, it was ONLY in cash at a coffee bar in downtown Itri with some mysterious Italian older man. Often, I would see homes started - but not yet finished on these hills, and I would ask my friends - what happened? Oh they did not pay the right money to the right person so the "authorities" stopped their construction mid-way. But I replied, but you told me that the home that we are currently renting for the summer is also not sanctioned and not legal - they replied, why do you think that we need to drive 1 time each month over the dusty hillside roads down into Itri to have coffee with that guy?? Then I understood everything...... So, Italy prepared me well for the ways of Thailand :>))

Wow @Verchiele what you write is SO true...... When I lived in Rome, Italy - my FAVORITE discoteca was the Muccassasina https://www.muccassassina.com/ Well, in one of their bathrooms (when it was operating out of the Qube building) - there was this extra "special" exit just near the urinals. Well, once you entered into this special exit - you entered into a dark maze where many of these HOT Italian guys (gay, bi, "straight") would have their pants open stroking on their meat. They would often join you, go down on you, or push your head down so you could service them. Often these interactions were quick - because often the guy would run back into the bathroom to clean up and go outside to rejoin his friends or girlfriend. On one of these encounters, I was so taken with one of these hot Italian studs that I followed him in a sneaky way - after he had just finished to blow me - and his girlfriend was waiting outside of the bathroom and she started to bark at him for taking so long as she wanted to dance and he just planted a big kiss on her lips to shut her up - I found that scene so enjoyable because 20 seconds prior his lips were busy servicing my cock and now he is kissing her.....amazing!!! So, what @Verchiele wrote, "and when people are "in the mood", I think a meat is a meat." 🤪

Hi Marc, I like, @Olddaddy, also agree 100% with what you wrote. Your Jey Spa experience was probably like my GLAM's Massage & Spa experience that I had at the end of August. When I returned to Jomtien after my many days in BKK with @vinapu, I was so excited to share my massage experiences with some of the local guys that I know here in Jomtien. In fact, one of them told me about the then breaking news that one of the massage shops was changing hands and that they would install someone that I know - as a mamasan to run that massage shop. This mamasan to-be is a she (a real girl) and is fun and very business minded. I told the new owners that they need to create an "appointed massage" (I put in quotes because I believe that you @Marc308 are referring to the BKK type of massage shops with booking appointment systems ?) like they have in BKK with a LINE and/or X (Twitter) frontend to allow us to peruse the guys on offer, etcetra. The reply that I got was not totally positive (as I had hoped) - what was said to me is that this new mamasan would fulfill the role like what BKK has on offer via the LINE and X (Twitter) booking information system - but instead as a human person interface. I personally know this fun and friendly woman, so I might not have any intimidations to discuss with her what I want and don't want for my massage selection. I just worry that perhaps most of you guys might not like this approach ?? Would you tell a woman that you do not know what you desire to do sexually with a massage guy ? I believe that the technology frontends - like they use in BKK is way less intimidating - for us shy types like myself - as I don't need to be shy when I am looking at the plethora of massage guys on offer in BKK via LINE and Twitter and then to write a message to the massage shops respective booking manager to finalize my selection. @Marc308, the only "appointed massage" place that I am aware of in Pattaya is the Healthland Spa https://www.healthlandspa.com/ --> which is a NO hanky panky place. In closing, due to the lack of a BKK type of massage booking approach in Pattaya - I have created my own private system - where currently, I use my favorite masseur to book for me different guys for our twice weekly 4 hands massages. He knows my type and he knows the type of program that I like. So, when he comes across some new guy, he gets their profile details (90% come from Hornet and 10% from Heesay) and shares them with me and he obtains other manhood details about the proposed guy's attributes and then I say yes or no and then the deal is done. I tend to not repeat them - as I like the newness and excitement of these meetings - but with him I truly enjoy to repeat my massages with him again and again. This "friendship" has evolved to outside of my bed and we also go out to hang out in the Jomtien Supertown Complex, restaurants, BINGO, beach, etcetra. It creates a steady income for him - and it gets me away from the stress of having to hunt for good guys for 4 hands massages - BECAUSE Pattaya does not have the BKK type of massage booking systems on offer. Yes, I can walk to the individual shops here in Jomtien and try to pick from the guys who are sitting outside all day in the hot sun - but once you go near them it becomes an uncontrolled feeding frenzy - which really puts me off and to organize a 4 hands massage like this is almost near impossible without the calmness of the BKK type of systems they have in place to keep things calm and organized and civilized.