jamiebee

13 paragraphs! PeterRS would approve (or be extremely jealous!). 😏

Sorry for the long post. But I realise that @Primeone385 was making assumptions -- understandble since he has not been in Thailand before -- about equivalency between what he's familiar with and what we're talking about here. And these assumptions about equivalency may not be valid, as @a-447 and @spoon have also pointed out. So I had to first explain the many ways in which "gogo bars" in Thailand are different before going on, and on and on (haha).

@Primeone385 It is very helpful that you have stated what your references and experiences have been. Doing so helps us understand your questions better. As you must have guessed, there is something very different about how bars operate in Thailand compared to the US or Brazil (I'm not sure how comparing bars to garoto saunas will help).
A very specific kind of bar
Firstly, I should clarify that there are many different kinds of bars in Thailand, and an outsider like yourself may not realise that this thread is only about one very specific type of bar which regular punters (sorry Americans, it's a British word) visiting Thailand tend to call "gogo bars", but which in my opinion is also not a very helpful term. It can mislead people to think that these bars are similar to what are also known as gogo bars in other countries. Language is full of these traps, where a term used in one country can refer to quite a different thing in another country. Ask a New Zealander what time he takes "tea", for example. Or compare what is an elk in Northern Europe versus an elk in North America.
Essentially, what we're referring to here is a bar whose two main business objectives are to sell drinks (like all bars) but also to sell boys' services. I suspect you've guessed all that already by reading the forum. The boys don't appear on stage one at a time which would be more typical of American bars. Because the Thai gogo bars are in a business of selling off-site services (as opposed to only visual entertainment/stripper acts for patrons), the business imperative is to offer a wide enough range of boys for customers to choose from, the same way a restaurant has to offer a range of dishes for customers to choose. Therefore a typical, successful bar of this type has to have 20, 30 or 40 boys on hand -- very different from American bars where having ten strippers on duty is plenty. That being the case, it is inefficient in a Thai gogo bar to have just one boy on stage at a time. Some bars have 4, 5 or 6 at a time. Others have 10 to 15 boys on stage simultaneously. This practice of "mass offering" impacts the next point:
The Big Cock Parade
Secondly, Most of the evening, the boys are not nude. So the discussion in this thread is only about a short period of say 15 - 20 minutes when (a) they are nude and (b) they circulate among the audience. This is part of what the bar calls "showtime" which is the part of the evening when the lights dim and the boys standing on stage to be "sold" are replaced by a curated programme of performances -- of varying quality, mostly amateurish. The one part of the "show" that is not amateurish however is the part I call in my blog the Big Cock Parade. That's when a series of boys appear on stage with erect members (a state that is almost always maintained by tourniquets) and, well, parade around. They then come down to the audience and offer patrons a chance for a ten-second grope. The thing to remember is that the parade may consist of as many as 10 to 12 boys and, down among the audience, they tend to approach customers uninvited. Sure, you don't have to touch; you can wave them away for which there is no obligation to tip, but many customers do not like feeling pressured to accept the grope offer with its consequent obligation to tip. Tastes vary and some customers do not find the boys attractive at all so their thinking is: why should I be obliged to give money in such a scenario?
Moreover, even if there was just one or two boys among the 10 to 12 whose cock one would gladly fondle (and tip), you may find that others will notice that you're the tipping sort. They'd notice that you didn't wave away Boy A or Boy B, and next thing you know, Boys C D E F G H and so on will be standing in line waiting for their turn with you. Yes it has happened to me, I'm not making it up. How does one tell Boy C "go away"? Even if you did, it won't deter Boy D. He would still be thrusting his dick at you thinking that OK, this old grunt might not like C, but maybe he likes me.
Tastes vary
One of the most striking observations one can make by following this forum is how tastes among members here vary. Some love the sight and feel of an erect penis. The Dominican Republic section is a case in point. I've joked before that over in that part of GayGuides, everything is about dick; nobody seems to care what kind of body a dick is attached to. I find it particularly amusing simply because I don't have the same fascination; I am more into massage and the full-body experience. So, for someone like me, to have a parade of 11 boys coming at me offering gropes and expecting payment – many of whom have neither physique nor personality I care for – gives me neither pleasure nor value. As you can see from earlier comments in this thread, there are others who feel the same way.
Values vary
Thank you for explaining that you're American (by that, I assume you mean USA) because one thing I have noticed as I travel around the around is that Americans tend to have a harder time than most understanding other cultures, countries and their operating systems. I think it was @jimmie50 who also noticed this (he himself is American) and he once made a comment, something to the effect that the rest of the world does things one way and Americans do things a different way. My advice to Americans when they leave their home country whether physically or when they explore other countries virtually as @Primeone385 is doing here, is to unlearn everything you've learned as an American. Be extra-careful that many of the things you subconsciously take for granted don't apply outside the US.
Different values is one of those things people seldom realise because values are so invisible. Narrowing this to the question of monetary valuation, there are huge differences between how people from different countries put value on something. One observation that I often hear from my friends (from various countries) is that Americans tend to overpay for certain things without even realising it. Just to give a few top-of-mind examples: healthcare; public transport (if it even exists at all in your city). And sex. This is not to say that other countries don't have their own craziness; they do. Indians overpay for weddings. Japanese overpay for gift wrappings. Filipinos overdo the bring-gifts-back-after-you-travel-abroad thing. In Jamaica young men, even unemployed ones hanging around street corners, cannot afford to be caught dead in anything less than new $200 sports shoes -- when their climate is one where sandals will do just fine.
And then there is the tipping culture in the US, which, as have been mentioned several times over many threads and many years in this forum, is widely seen as madness by the rest of the world. Americans have become inured to the expectation and practice of throwing money at people when no value is returned, and the rest of world sees this as some kind of psychopathy.
... which brings me to another implicit assumption that we need to be aware of. I have noticed that Americans participating in this forum, especially newer members, tend to assume they're talking to other Americans who likely share their same value system. As I have often pointed out, this is not the case. In fact, we cannot even assume that members here are predominantly White folks from western countries. There are Asians here, particularly in the Asia threads. Consequently, many conversations here are predicated by different value systems.
What does a "price" mean?
Coming back to the issue of tipping for the chance to manhandle erect dicks, the question was why such a big deal about a 100 baht tip? To reduce that to "only USD3.00" takes the discussion off onto a track that does not lead to understanding. It's not the dollars, it's the principle of being obliged to tip in an unasked-for situation. This objection is heightened when people come from cultures without a tipping culture; they don't tip at restaurants, they don't tip taxi-drivers, etc. It's just not normal to tip when no significant additional value is returned. Mix in the context of an unasked-for situation, it gets worse.
Now, one may argue that the bar situation we're speaking about is one where value is returned. There is at least the overall entertainment value offered by the bar e.g. in putting up a show programme, and so one shouldn't begrudge the expectation of gratuities. But here again, we run up against value differences. In many countries, all-in pricing is normative. Having to pay extra is not. For example, in the US, my experience (correct me if the situation is now different and I am wrong) is that airline websites quote a price and then only at the point of payment do they add taxes, raising the final price. In many countries this would be illegal. The airline has to display the full price inclusive taxes right at the start. In such cultures, e.g. Thailand (but also most of Asia), customers go into gogo bars with a subliminal notion that the menu or verbally quoted price of the drink or whatever other add-ons would be inclusive of entertainment. The "justification" that extra gratuities are expected for the entertainment just seems very strange, in the same way that if extra gratuities are expected for a waiter to bring your ordered dish to your table, that would be weird too.
It's the same with the sex businesses in Japan. They quote an all-inclusive price and no one is expected to tip extra. Over on the Japanese threads you still see Americans asking how much should I tip? They've been acculturated to feel intolerably guilty if they didn't throw money at the boy. It's been internalised so deeply.

Isn't it better to ask the guy directly? Isn't that the whole point of seating with him?
I mean, language and music volume barriers preclude verbal dialogue, so it's just translater interaction. And, as mentioned above - there's no fondling touching kissing. So isnt the seating aimed at checking and negotiating ?

I guess if you are comparing western type strip bar, it is not the same. And in most western strip bar, strippers is not prostitute. I can say bars like Gass is more of that concept, inviting famous gogo dancer to perform in the bar for the masses
Most of the bars we talk here are a front for a brothel in western countries, where you literally can ask the mamasan what do the guys do and dont and size of cock, etc. you pay off fee to the bar to take them off to your hotel or short time room nearby.
Yes 100 tip is 3 times higher than 1 dollar u dispense at strip bar. But my 100 baht goes to a guy i might want to take home later. It shows my interest, and i can also check if he returns the interest. I can also do more with a drink, which will cost more but he will sit with me shirtless for a while until he finish his drink. But for a quick check, 100 is worth the investment for me.
And if i buy them a drink, it can be as simple as just talking to know each other, to dealing with a short or longtime arrangement, and/or having fun in the bar. Usually nothing obscene, just discreet fun, kissing, hands roaming undershirt/short etc. nothing exposed
Also strip bar, private dance will cost you 30-50 bucks for one song. Short time (30min-2hour) is 2k-2.5k here.

If there are pillows on the sofas, is the first hint that it goes on there.....😬

Is it customary to fondle guys seating with u? If memory serves I witnessed and practiced that only in that pattaya promiscuous bar (winner or nice boys).
The fondling there went all the way to mutual exposed jerking...

it may happen in Tawan on certain days, certainly happened during my visit earlier this year but not on my last visit there

Or how about 'oohhh, 'wow' and 'fuuuuck!'

The problem with a term like "Supersoft" when translated into English is that it connotes a level of service that is extra light when compared to what is meant by "soft". So, if "soft" is just a handjob, "supersoft" suggests something even less interactive than that. No wonder people find it hard to parse this term.
The better way to describe the three categories would be Soft, Soft-plus and Hard.

Soft is hand job. Super soft is more (kissing, oral, body to body). I think these terms come from Thai culture or language used in an English language context.

As mentioned earlier, the Meridien provides plenty of towels!

My recommendation would be to use paper towels, not tissues. They hold up better and don’t leave little bits of paper sticking to skin and appendages. That is unless I am talking about something totally unrelated. If that is the case, nevermind. 😆

Why? Do your friends have severe allergies? Wouldn't having a bottle of antihistamines on your night stand be more helpful? Perhaps bring your own diffuser and sprinkle it with a few drops of eucalyptus oil or Vicks Vaporub.

Now I usually book 56 surawong cos the rooms are decent in size and if you book their comfy room, it's really not that bad. The only thing I didn't like was that they don't provide tissues... I have to make sure I have my own supply when I have "friends" over 🤭

That can be sais about 44 hotels in the immediate area. Some of them offer bigger rooms that post card sized Ibis Styles does.

I've only stayed there about 3 or 4 times, and have had two types of rooms. The smallest type have external windows, but they're really tight. The slightly bigger ones face inwards towards the central atrium, so one cannot draw open the curtains without letting others look in. In short, I agree with @vinapu I think there are better alternatives than this hotel.

Yes,

Big boys naked on stage jerking off another guy comes around for tips and after big boy finishes. We were seated in front I asked guy I was with if we should wear rain jackets 😂

Good choice of location!

I’m gonna be at the Ibis Styles Silom which seems to be in the middle of everything.

Oh good this wasn’t on my radar.

They definitely were previous week when I was in Bangkok. Few hunks were keeping duty on market level trying to attract passerby to step in.

I also prefer the muscular guys and have always made Tawan my first port of call in Bangkok. Quarter Silom became my hotel of choice as it's only a hop, step and a jump away. Tawan is certainly not what it was back in the day, but there is still muscle to be found there.
I was wondering if Bigboy was still operating. Vinapu and I went there just after it opened and there were very few guys on stage. I thought there was no way it could survive. So I'm glad that it's still around and I will check it out when I next visit Bangkok.

I am currently on a trip to bangkok. I visited the new bar “big boys” in Patpong. Few customers however they still did show, they also did live cum show. They have muscle guys. Might be a thing for you. I visited Tawan once on my first visit didn’t like it, the guys at big boy a lot more attractive in my opinion.

@Brak , you might be thinking of Moonlight, not Midnight if you're into muscular guys. Midnight is an open-air beer bar located on Patpong 2. You can try that too, as boys can be offed from Midnight, but for big hunks, Moonlight is the bar with muscular models.