Middle East Air Travel Severely Disrupted

[PeterRS]

Trump's forces' assassination of the Supreme Leader of Iran will, I believe, be welcomed by many millions in Iran. They knew he was a tyrant and very corrupt to boot. But Iran or its proxies have started to retaliate. Dubai, Doha, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Kuwait and Oman have been the target of drone and other attacks at airports and elsewhere. One man has been killed at Dubai Airport which has since been closed to air traffic. Emirates has cancelled all flights until 3:00 pm UK time. As of 50 minuutes ago, there was still no notification as to when the airport will reopen. Emirates will then determine if any can flights can continue depending on the status of the airport. British Airways has cancelled several flights to the region.

With many visitors to Thailand and Asia changing aircraft at Middle East airports, the advice is check with your airline if your flight is likely to take off or has been cancelled.

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/cn5ge95q6y7t

[forrestreid]

This could impact on flights transiting through the Gulf for a while. I see the well known Youtuber GabrielTraveler was caught out and is now stuck in Qatar:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krw66qLUoD0

 

[mauRICE]

1 hour ago, PeterRS said:

Trump's forces' assassination of the Supreme Leader of Iran will, I believe, be welcomed by many millions in Iran. They knew he was a tyrant and very corrupt to boot. 

No. Here are some of the most recent pictures of Iranians in Teheran and Isfahan coming out to mourn the murder of the Ayatollah, the Imam Khameini, in contrast to the fake clips produced by the Zionist-Trump propaganda machine of a few Middle Eastern-looking men and women coming out on the streets to celebrate "Iran's" so-called freedom. These are a proud, strong, intelligent people who have roots in the land and a civilisation dating back to 4000-3000 BC, not some white imports from Europe claiming some kind of mythical ownership in the last 75 years.

Moreover, Israel uses it's biggest proxy, the US, to fight her wars on her behalf. Most of Iran's retaliatory actions have been against American bases in the region. Meanwhile it has been reported that Israel dropped bombs on a school in Iran, instantly killing at least 85 people, most of whom were women and schoolgirls. Typical, isn't it, they always kill the children first. And if you want to talk about tyranny and corruption, why not start with Trump and his master and butt buddy Netanyahu.

[caeron]

 

Trump is corrupt. That doesn't make the 'supreme leader' any less of a monster.

Thousands, maybe tens of thousands, of protesters have been murdered by the regime.

Not that bombing will help. A new 'supreme leader' will arise in time and the cycle will repeat.

 

[mauRICE]

55 minutes ago, caeron said:

Not that bombing will help. A new 'supreme leader' will arise in time...

I hope a Iran will have a strong leader who will pull the country together and stand up against the US and the genocidal Israeli regime and their illegal acts of aggression.

[PeterRS]

I do not know who is in those photos - and I do not rule out that they are photoshopped or dredged up from previous national outpourings of joy. Have you actually spokne to any Iranians. Having spent two weeks in Iran only a few years ago, everyone I spoke to hated - absolutely hated - the leadership. Everyone knew they were massively corrupt - as you could tell from the up-market expensive housing in part of Teheran reserved for senior leaders, their acolytes and the Iranian Guard. You can certainly start with the evils perpetrated by Trump and Netanyahu if you wish, but do not confuse Iran with the USA and Israel. There will be rejoicing in many milions of households even though they may not be able yet to show it. I agree entirely about iran being a long-established and massively proud nation. But once the loathed Iranian Revolutionary Guard is out of the way - assuming that actually happens - then you will see real rejoicing.

[caeron]

 

If you're a fan of the Islamic regime in Iran, you are really in the wrong place here. You can get the death penalty there for gay sex.

[dellboy]

1 minute ago, caeron said:

 

If you're a fan of the Islamic regime in Iran, you are really in the wrong place here. You can get the death penalty there for gay sex.

that was worth saying a second time !!!!

[PeterRS]

25 minutes ago, caeron said:

If you're a fan of the Islamic regime in Iran, you are really in the wrong place here. You can get the death penalty there for gay sex.

That is highly unlikely. My guide for two weeks had a hooker in every city we visited. He said that anything is possible in Iran as long as you are discrete about it. The way it was perfectly obvious that sanctions were being broken seemed to bear that out. To be fair, he personally did not know any gay men but he said there were quite a number known to his friends.

In addition to being a nation of people intensely proud of their history and culture, I think we should also remember that people in Iran have no love for America. They cannot forgive the USA for the way it joined forces with the British to get rid of the duly elected Prime Minister Mohammad Mosaddegh in 1953 and replace him with the undemocratic Shah. They then hated the USA for the way it assisted the Shah in his reign of terror with massive aounts of arms and cash, one reason for their welcoming Khomeini back in his place. And they then hated the USA for explicitly siding with Saddam Hussein in the vicious 8-year Iraq/Iran war when iraq used chemical weapons.

One subject I did not bring up when I spoke to ordinary Iranians was Israel and therefore have no contribution on that matter. 

[mauRICE]

1 hour ago, PeterRS said:

I do not know who is in those photos - and I do not rule out that they are photoshopped or dredged up from previous national outpourings of joy. Have you actually spokne to any Iranians. Having spent two weeks in Iran only a few years ago, everyone I spoke to hated - absolutely hated - the leadership. Everyone knew they were massively corrupt - as you could tell from the up-market expensive housing in part of Teheran reserved for senior leaders, their acolytes and the Iranian Guard. You can certainly start with the evils perpetrated by Trump and Netanyahu if you wish, but do not confuse Iran with the USA and Israel. 

Ohh no, I would never confuse Iran with the US or the genocidal Israeli regime. I think they are far worse. Do we really want to talk about the killing of the native Americans, the treatment of the Black slaves, the killing and brutality towards Blacks and immigrants today, the possibly hundreds of thousands of Palestinians who have been murdered or displaced?

I regularly speak to Iranians, currently and consistently, not "a few years ago". Many of the young ones study in my country and live in apartments and houses that I rent out. I often take my tenants and lodgers out for a meal and none of them have vilified their leadership as you have described. Just last week I held an iftar feast for all my tenants at a local hotel, some fifty of them, Muslim and non-Muslim, and most of the Iranian students were worried for their families and friends back home if the US and the genocidal Israeli regime were to attack. None said they they wanted an intervention by the US or its Zionist butt buddy.

My whatsapp has been buzzing non-stop in the last 24 hours as the Iranian students seek a big brother to vent their worries and a shoulder to cry on. I try to do what I can but I've also engaged a mental health counsellor for them at my expense. As it is, quite a few of them are already prone to PTSD as a result of years of sanctions imposed by the US at the behest of the genocidal Israeli regime.

I've also been to Iran several times and stayed in the houses of Iranians who are great friends of mine. A beautiful country - second only to Turkiye in my opinion - and a very hospitable people. Sure, there's some discontentment here and there but none have expressed the absolute hatred of their government as you've described. They feel change, if any, should come from within and in their own time and way.

Incidentally, political and government leaders everywhere tend to live in affluent areas and upmarket housing. Do Thai politicians live in the slums of Klong Toey; do British MPs live in council flats?

I think colonials need to remove their pith helmets and get rid of that misguided and misplaced saviour mentality. It didn't work 200 years ago; it's not going to work now. 

 

 

[caeron]

 

A quick google shows me two reported executions in 2022, and two in 2021. I imagine there are others.

I'm not going to defend the west's behavior, but that doesn't make what the Iranian government does any bit better.

I think you can think both parties are bad. Like Israel's government and Hamas. 

It is, perhaps, possible that bombs will change the Iranian government, but I think it very unlikely. Magical thinking. I think the most likely outcome is that the Revolutionary Guard will tighten their grip on a country in shambles.

 

[PeterRS]

11 hours ago, mauRICE said:

Ohh no, I would never confuse Iran with the US or the genocidal Israeli regime.

I now appreciate that your knowledge of the Iranian people is far greater than mine. That said, I can understand Iranians studying in the USA not wishing to spread even dislike of their regime. Who knows who might be listening or to whom adverse comments might be conveyed? All I stated was true - as I am certain all you have stated is true. But I am far from a being a colonial or thinking like a cololnial, as I think my previous posts on colonialism have made very clear, especially in Asia where I have spent more than half my llife.

I have to add, though, that in the limited sampling of people I spoke to I never heard anyone suggest that change would have to come from within the country. They realised the grip of the ruling mullahs and the Revolutionary Guard was all pervasive. They had seen attempted revolutions put down with the utmost severity. They were well aware of the endemic corruption within the ruling elite. To be fair, none provided an answer as to how the ruling elite could be taken down. They just agreed that on the course it was taking when I was there, the country was just going to get worse for ordinary people. They had witnessed how at the turn of the century the moderate President Mohammad Khatami had attempted to create a more moderate Iran, only to be foiled when the Supreme Leader started to interfere with who could run for the Presidency to ensure he was more in line with his own hard line rule.

[PeterRS]

2 hours ago, caeron said:

It is, perhaps, possible that bombs will change the Iranian government, but I think it very unlikely. Magical thinking. I think the most likely outcome is that the Revolutionary Guard will tighten their grip on a country in shambles.

I think we should remember that Iran has a population of around 93 million. The Revolutionary Guard only has around 125,000 regular members with 90,000 reservists. But during the Presidency of Mahmoud Ahmadinejad its role expanded very considerably to the point where it is involved in most aspects of the country's economy, such that in 2019 Reuter's described it as "an industrial empire with political clout." Some western experts suggest it exercises a greater role in the running of the country than the ruling mullahs.

It is certainly feared. On one trip to see the tomb of Cyrus The Great, my driver/guide saw ahead a car that had been stopped by a unit of the Revolutionary Guard with the driver being questioned outside the car. "We don't want to go near there" said my driver whereupon he executed a quick U-turn and off we sped.

[vinapu]

12 hours ago, mauRICE said:

 

I think colonials need to remove their pith helmets and get rid of that misguided and misplaced saviour mentality. It didn't work 200 years ago; it's not going to work now. 

 

 

+1

[vinapu]

12 hours ago, PeterRS said:

Having spent two weeks in Iran only a few years ago, everyone I spoke to hated - absolutely hated - the leadership. 

not to question at all what you are saying I have two comments here :

1/ it's one thing to hate country leadership but another to applaud that leadership removal  by external force. Even if one thinks removal of Maduro or Khamenei was overall benefocial and God Bless America for that what if Orange Overlord  decides to remove in the same manner Ms. Sheinbaum, Lula, Mertz or even Anutin ?

2/ this afternoon I spoke to my cousin who was in USA ( Connecticut ) attending her godson wedding. She is  mild Trumpist and was shocked because " Vinapu , everyone I spoke to hated - absolutely hated - Trump " . We can agree that her social circle there is not exactly reflecting overall mood prevailing in America, no?

 

[PeterRS]

1 hour ago, vinapu said:

1/ it's one thing to hate country leadership but another to applaud that leadership removal  by external force. Even if one thinks removal of Maduro or Khamenei was overall benefocial and God Bless America for that what if Orange Overlord  decides to remove in the same manner Ms. Sheinbaum, Lula, Mertz or even Anutin ?

SInce WWII, like it or not, the USA has been the world's policeman. No other country has had anything like its military - although today China is getting closer. So the world has had to put up with the USA's actions, like them or not. I remember when Tony Blair appointed an Ambassador to Washington at the start pf the 2000s, his instructions were, "I want you to get up George Bush's ass and stay there!" In other words, we need to know what the USA is planning.

Not that that worked out at all well for Blair. There were massive protests in the UK and he ended up having zero influence on Bush and his neocon's decision to go to war with iraq. That war was one based on false pretences and one that Blair eventually went on television to apologise for going along with that decision. Has Bush apologised? Silly joke! 

The fact is that the USA can basically do what it wishes until such time as another Empire rises and Washington finally realises that the consequences for the USA will be greater than the action it thought of taking. Yet the post WWII period has not always seen the USA having its own way. There was another time at the start of the 1970s when OPEC decided to flex its oil muscles and raised the price of oil four fold, eventually to rise even further. This created panic in financial markets and led to massive inflation in the west for more than a decade. Inflation in the UK rose to 25% in 1975 with an average of 13% over the decade. With many countries involved in that OPEC decision - including, it should be said, Iran the USA's proxy in the Middle East - there was absolutely nothing the USA could do other than attempt to ramp up its own internal production.

As long as the USA has Israel as its excuse, whatever it does in the Middle East will go unchallenged. There are too many competing factions within the Islamic countries for them to form a coalition to temper the USA's ambitions (i.e. Trump's ambitions). But getting rid of leaders, sometimes with a coalition it formed and sometimes siding with opposition movements more pro to USA policies - Egypt, Guatemala, Iran, Indonesia (failed), Syria (failed), Iraq, South Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, The Congo, Chile, Bolivia, Ethiopia, Australia, Angola, East Timor, Argentina, Afghanistan, Chad, Nicaragua, Grenada, Panama, Zaire - the list goes on, I submit it is unlikely to stop until US policy changes or another Empire becomes the world's policeman. 

[unicorn]

1 hour ago, PeterRS said:

SInce WWII, like it or not, the USA has been the world's policeman...

Reminds me of that movie... 😄

 

 

[PeterRS]

The refeence in the vdo to Air America is more than pertinent. It was the cover for the CIA and responsible for its operations during the wars in IndoChina. It established a secret airbase in the northern Laos jungle at Long Tieng. For years it had the most flights of any airport in the world, frequently handling 400 aircraft movements a day.

Ironically, though, the airlline and its handlers were responsible for the importation of a mass of opium and heroin into the United States. 

[unicorn]

On a personal note, I'd sure like to be able to safely visit Iran one of these days. Hopefully it won't remain a theocracy until the day I die.

[caeron]

 

Yup, America Fuck Yeah! We can kick anybody's ass. We often do. What happens after? Who cares, cause fuck yeah, we kicked their ass! Did you see how we freedom'd those terrorist muthafuckers into the ground. America! Freedom! Freedom and Guns! Guns and some Freedom, but especially Guns! Guns are Freedom! If you shoot them, it's freedom, so they deserved it. Let's freedom the world! We're going to need a LOT of ammunition for that!

(I am appalled by the behavior of the current administration, and by much of my country's historical behavior. I can mock it, but I can't change it.  But none of that excuses similar behavior in others. If we condemn it, we condemn it everywhere with what small influence we have on the outcome. Often merely our voices.)

[caeron]

 

I share Unicorn's desire to visit Iran. Unfortunately, they are known to take western hostages and I have many familial links to the US military and intelligence community, so travel today seems very, very unwise. I very much hope one day a better Iran emerges that I might be able to visit.