pong

Was there some 2-3 yrs ago for a short while. Myself not that much interested in such types, so just general info. Manilla does have (had, no idea about how corona works out there) several gay saunaś and massageplaces, not so much anymore in the sentral/downtown area but in Quezon, which is a separate area but just part of the same mega-city. If there are any sauna;ś that would offer more in commercial offers I dk. I visited a msg place which works much the same as in BKK (which I visit very frequently since many yrs) or Pnom Penh- you select a masseur and once in the cubicle you make an arrangement for ´special extra´ services-which one generally does not in BKK (it just comes naturally there) and which/what/how muth etc. Do not expect (contrary to general description) that all Pinoy guys are fluent in english. I remember i choose from an ´aquarium´ where the guys stand behind a glass screen. If some of these shops specialise in your type of guy I also dk.
On the old shamelessmack blog (part 1-now long ago) and on travelgaysia you can find reviews and listings.
Most other postings etc i saw on the other well known fora recommend the usual moderntimes contact sites to make a selection.
If youre still in doubt, also consider Bali/Indonesia.

Was there some 2-3 yrs ago for a short while. Myself not that much interested in such types, so just general info. Manilla does have (had, no idea about how corona works out there) several gay saunaś and massageplaces, not so much anymore in the sentral/downtown area but in Quezon, which is a separate area but just part of the same mega-city. If there are any sauna;ś that would offer more in commercial offers I dk. I visited a msg place which works much the same as in BKK (which I visit very frequently since many yrs) or Pnom Penh- you select a masseur and once in the cubicle you make an arrangement for ´special extra´ services-which one generally does not in BKK (it just comes naturally there) and which/what/how muth etc. Do not expect (contrary to general description) that all Pinoy guys are fluent in english. I remember i choose from an ´aquarium´ where the guys stand behind a glass screen. If some of these shops specialise in your type of guy I also dk.
On the old shamelessmack blog (part 1-now long ago) and on travelgaysia you can find reviews and listings.
Most other postings etc i saw on the other well known fora recommend the usual moderntimes contact sites to make a selection.
If youre still in doubt, also consider Bali/Indonesia.

its definitely the worst of the options-the road is much faster, as its the triangle-shape: on the iron roads you travel via the longer 2 sectors.
THE world wide site for any Qs re trains is seat61.com, but do realise its anti-bus.
To the Q'depends on the train and the comfort wished for. In fact 3d cl canNOT even be reserved in most trains. There is 1 morning train which is more like a bus on rails and has only AC 2nd cl. Must be reserved-that comes together automatic with the ticket. May sell out on busy days. Also for the views its worthless: windows are opaque and as soon as there is a ray of sun any decent Thai closes the curtains etc. There may-or may not now-still be some food offered-think of a 20 bt box of rice with a few chickenpieces.
From around 14.00 the overnight trains to the far south start running, these vary in what they offer and their prices. 1st cl. is totally unnecessary for that sector-its an enclosed 2 berth compartment with AC, meant for sleeping overnight. Remaining empty space for NOT overnight (thus to HH ) will only be sold on the day itself and is due to all the supllmts. very expensive for the distance and only available on a few crack premium trains. Its now fairly easy to book yourself on the site of the SRT=State Railways-again see seat61 for the details. Expect late arrivals of 30 mns to hours-its mostly still single track so trains must wait for all the delays coming from south up.
BIG bus is now much fewer as before and leaves from the faraway Sai Thai NEW Terminal along the western ring rd. This is VIP or 1st cl. and should be 1st choice-except for the nasty dep.point and few trips left.  2nd cl is now all VAN=minibus, often with terrific speeding and idiot drivers, TiTs after all and go very often -ev 20/30 mins all together from various terminals. Sites like busbud or rome2rio are notorious bad informed about things bus here in TH-often relying on data from 5-10 yrs ago.
Most people/tourists in fact use the direct bus from Swampy airport. There are also a few direct buses from Mochit terminal, these come from further north.
@909-good luck tomorrow, its stillChin.NwYr so many a transpo is mobbed out.

The KHmer govmt rather wants their citizens to stay in TH, and there are near a milion of them.
There are BUSes by the dozen and this is the usual way about any Khmer travels back home. Do I really need to explain this will also be the cheapest option by far?
It also seems there si now some special respite from Thai immi for those who have to overstay due to canceled flutes or border bands, etc, but I DK if/how this effects Khmer.

No, you were too early, Since at least 1 yr now the carts & all that are only allowed in after 15/16.00. But the works seem to be done quite rigorously and the whole streetsurface gets rebuilt, incl all the pipes etc. Was intended to be finished before the infamous Songkran water-wars, but these are said to have been cancelled.
The magic of KSR for young bekpekkers were also the said to be thousands of nice&willing Thai girls for interracial meetings. An awful long time ago (probably still <2000 and the beach) there was even a small gay such scene. Its fading glory is also speeded up by the new generation not reading guidebooks anymore and the ready supply of 1000s of assumed cheap hoStels now about anywhere in BKK listed on the well known booking sites. In the past you had to go there for cheap beds.
Much better food&entertainmant however can be had in the side streets, Rambuttree and its continuation ´hlang wat´=behind the wat. KSR is more deafening loud music and emptying green big bottles of Chang.

Define good. And just a HJ? I dont go for that.
As this is mostly centered on the Silom area (ghetto): about any of the millions (nah, yah, 100s at least) of msg shops all around, and more those staffed mostly with guys, will offer a chance of at least 90% this will be offered. Try soi 6 linking Silom with Suriwong. Then follows mostly the price haggling, which puts me off a lot. The general verdict is that the sooner this is offered, the less ´good´ the msg as such will be. But then what is thought of as being a really good msg in the Thai sense for a Thai (no oil) msg is alien to many a farang-and many of them dont even like it that much. Perhaps the tipical masochist more as Joe 6pack.
There IS a rather practical thing to consider: I am pretty sure you will appreciate the privacy, or as far as this is possible in a place where there are no real private rooms, or at least the guy will. The key to that is to order not Thai, not foot/back, but OIL msg. You will have to undress fully and shower before. There will be a modesty towel draped over you whilst the job is done. The rest of possible changes in the protocol is then up to you.
Div.madman posting above here has produced an excellent blog about this for places that will offer more, have only male staff etc. he even did not link to it. (in some places an update is already needed-things change fast here in BKK)
As for me: IF the wish is for a good real msg, then use my preferred shop/masseur as far away from Silom as possible. If more is wanted at the time, go for a dedicated m2m place and do not expect the msg to be really good, but sometimes surprises happen and a really erotic, sensual and slow skilfull  heating up and followed by the deed can be enjoyed. Places offering this as a matter of fact mostly state far higher tips in the 1000+ range.
PRIME has somehow made it on the bucketlist of ASEANs, and/or Chinese after the WatPo experience (not at all rec. by others) and now wants a MIn 100 bt tip (so an average masseur doubles his daily normal income). There are isolated reports that the ´boss´ has forbidden staff to offer anything more as the msg.

@Thitipoom Techaapaikhum. Mentioned above as player in Waterboy and  dark Blue kiss and before in Room Alone:
was featured int he latest=now current issue of free TimeOut BKK. (6-20/2/20, often to be found in *beks cf). This may surprise you: NIckname is NEW. he was a student at Chula (among the best of a real UNI anywhere in TH) and has MBA in engineering.  Now also plays the stockmarket  and is mesmerised by nrs.. Tries to be as honest as poss to the many fans and says he never pretended to be anyone other as...........
NOw has a role in a movie Classic Again. Should have reached the cinema by now. That way he discovered the old slow pace of life and the meaning of written letters.

Interesting read, feminds me of former job-had something to do with hosp. and tourism  etc. now in pension as as many may remember mot at all a fan of staying in that area or even visiting often.
So this is mostly for the record or for the (praise them!) ´cheaposkatos.
YELLOW INN is above an Indian restr on Suriwong, close to Tarntwn, rooms around 7/800 (Booking) and a complaint in review: guest friendly (lady) but the place was condoned as they wanted to hold ID at reception of the lady. Looks like a converetd shophouse and must be noisy, I think.
There is even 1 hidden in the subsoi across Super A; KINNON hoStel, also does dormbeds.
In soi 6/Silom end: the FAH, around corner of Prime
Something named like UK-Thai guesthse, same corner, never ever read something about it.
HEAVEN (not the sauna!) is a place in the centre where ARENA is, left hand and also advertises a hostel. More hoStels in that road where the BTS turns in along Skywalk Mahanakorn. There must also be a nice rooftop(beer)garden, but I could not see how to enter that.
Under construction to help alleviate the apparent shortage of rooms in this area:
IBIS STYLES along Silom, roughly opposite Patpong, to open mid 2020. Expect lower introdct. rates. BUT IBIS is alas famous for very noisy (chinese) tourgroups.
A rather large HTL in the mid of soi 6, beside MANGO restrt. UNIQUE? or whatever.
Some remarks re above:
BBB now definitely all closed and in near state of being dismantled Also at least 1 of the 2 hoStels that were around there.
Both Pavillion and the one on the corner at Tawan were previously only short time rooms. From many moons ago I remember Pav as hospital -sterile all white.
The former OmYim, praised here many moons ago, is still operating as cheapo placeo under other name.
Red Planet used to be AirAsia HTL, here is also one near Term21 across near Sukhumvit, just like the EASY HTLs in EUr. In the past you paid-just as with tix-the base price and could add for extra what you wanted: AC, sheets, towels, WiFi, etc. This would not work in Asia.
Re booking things:
as above, in general many Thai HTLs are not that familiair (yet) with all the US technicalities of those sites. Agoda often seems lower, as it omits taxes-in the end you pay samesame as bkg, bkg has bought agoda a few yrs ago. In the EU this is not allowed at all, but here anything goes. same applies to airlines.
This is a warning from inside: IF a HTL offers (some) notorious cheaper rooms this may mean they dump off their bad rooms for that that noone in the know wants. Its generally not possible to ask to see rooms etc on such an advance bkg. Once a HTL knows you, just mail them, ask for your favorite rm and propose/ask a price. May not work in really big chain HTls though.
Key deposit is not just for a new key, but for exchange of wholelock etc. For keycards for the readers etc. Or-at least-that is the explanation. You may not really have lost it and come back later to steal from the next guest if just key replaced by locksmith.
And yes-experience- the cheaper Thai style HTLs do not maintenance, some do not even know how to. It just fades and gets broken here and there etc. Staff is or maybe brilliant nice or wont give a hink or even know what to do. ANY cheaper HTL (say under 600-local rate) will have some hidden notsonice things. Complaining wont help a penny. In the 600-1200 band it maybe or may not. Above 1500 you can expect normal service and that things work etc.

Its been said so many times now-for the real gems of Khmerland simply stay in BKK or PTY. The carrots of higher pay and more customers are a real draw. My last visit there was by now some 3-4 yrs ago and I found it about as dirty/backward in many respects as Burma then. Indeed-somehow their style of msg pales compared with Thai. Later reviwes say Hata (=hands) Khmer has gone much downhill.
But in general here in BKK my meets with Khmer are generally quite good to excellent. IF they speak english, they do it far better as the average Thai working in touristy things.
As an aside: the trains run again (mostly around weekends, incl. to Thai border now, also daily to airport), there is now a cheap/free (for any >70) citybus in PnPn and also a cheap (20 bt/2000 rl) boat service along the river close by PnPn. Check for blogs movetocambodia.com

This price cntrol is most likely just as effective as any Thai govmt regulation: the stocks disappears behind the counter.
On a more happy and reassuring note: untill now (but lets see this evening) Ive not seen any of the guys we long for in such places with facemasks. Would look a bit silly-near naked in underwear and gogo dancing but with a mask on. Guess they already know what vinapu is his wisdom says: the more exposure to bad germs, the better the resistance. Perhaps we can offer a prize to the first one who spots such a guy.
Staff policy at 7-the one shop about anyone is bound to visit sometime whilst here-is that they have to wear masks.

Yesterday at the entrance of a catholic school (thus no govmt. one); big signs that as from now plastic bags, and also plastic straws and those styrofoam foodcontainers that any Thai seems to use 5/week at least are forbidden entry. A bit like EUR schools who ban candies and oversweet things or fatty crisps=chips.
So just a sec later a chinese looking lad with his mum in his special uniform walked out, clutching a plastic bag, with the usual drink plastic cup with a large straw in it.........
With a few more things as normal (this week very good promosyens) at 7 they still offered me an extra bag, whilst the recorded announcement of banning bags was just playing. I refused, as I have my own and am very well used to bring your own @ home.

re Arena: reports they push their premium/VIP are rife on some sites, but Ive never encountered this. They do also entertain Chinese girls and these get many hugs and kisses after they leave. Perhaps there is more as 1 ICE, as I remember one with no tattoos at all (and also not showing off his naked upper half-always a shirt). All prices end on 90 and they have an interesting way to keep that 10 bt coin.......
Tip: Arena has indeed mostly slightly older and very well experienced guys, quite a few do not come daily, and formerly worked at the old Hero (Thai say it like Kee-Low) and have great technique. Ask for them. I once witnessed some very nervous chinese looking customer who asked and asked-manager shouted something and each time a few guys stepped away-like musical chairs. I could not understand what he was asking for.
The very much older and more unsightly men are those with the so prized goods who went shopping at BigC.

One of these parrotted recycled stories-this yard is near closed or is already or will be this year. The MAIN repair yard is daft easy to see when you sit in any northbound train just beyond Bang Sue Junction stop=more or less beside the brand new still under constr. BKK main Train terminal-due to open late this/early next yr. Its in fact very likely that when this station opens the old eastern line on the ground is to close all the way where its under the ARL=thats Lard Krabang.
Makkasan has been the subject of yearslong debate about what to turn into-the greenies want it to be a park, the thinkmoneyallthetimies (SRT has so giant big losses that any relief is welcome) in-of course-you guess it- another brandnew giant shoppingcentre
For really old time fashioned railway repair yards go to Burma or Vietnam.
Real trains/railway aficionadoś go to skyscrapercity and read the many reports of khun Wisaruth, a pensioned former SRT official.

One of these parrotted recycled stories-this yard is near closed or is already or will be this year. The MAIN repair yard is daft easy to see when you sit in any northbound train just beyond Bang Sue Junction stop=more or less beside the brand new still under constr. BKK main Train terminal-due to open late this/early next yr. Its in fact very likely that when this station opens the old eastern line on the ground is to close all the way where its under the ARL=thats Lard Krabang.
Makkasan has been the subject of yearslong debate about what to turn into-the greenies want it to be a park, the thinkmoneyallthetimies (SRT has so giant big losses that any relief is welcome) in-of course-you guess it- another brandnew giant shoppingcentre
For really old time fashioned railway repair yards go to Burma or Vietnam.
Real trains/railway aficionadoś go to skyscrapercity and read the many reports of khun Wisaruth, a pensioned former SRT official.

Tip/hint for others who may think of going VTE/Laos: any ASEAN does not need visa. Farang do, but that simply means paying 30/40US$ on entry-depends on your nationality. THai can even sneak in for a day or 2 with their ID only but are then restricted to the province of VTE, not whole country.
To cut the cost of going there-I will not recommend overnight train to NonghKhai+shuttle trainlet acros brdige-thats for diehard railfans. Nor the many overnight or also daytime long-dist. buses.
FLY to Udorn at domestic rate-also flights from that Pattaya airprt and take direct van/shuttlebus from airpt to Borderbridge and onward. Takes a ittle longer but can save nearly half the price. Its in fact only very recently that Laos allowed budgetflites in-they want to protect their own feeble state-airline.
And once again we see that here in TH nothing ever is the same-same for anyone anywhere-exceptions, in this case very nice ones (had those too last week) en sometimes not so nice are always to be expected. You make this story quite with some cliffhangers-so that people get very curious about what to happen next.

Hm, just today and not at all in Chinatown I saw many prices for bowls of soupy noodles for 30 bt /big or even  25/normal and yesterday even for 13 (but that was chan lek=small bowl) on a night fair. On the Nonthburi market was many years a very big shop selling noodlesoup for 5, then 8 bt, I think its still there (probably 15 r 20 bt now)-boat noodles Ayuttaya style. Traffic was a breeze today-no jams, a trip that would normally even on sunday take 70-80 mins was now 40/45.
These mentioned songhtaews (similar to Pattaya ´baht bus´ but red=the universal colour for BKK, but for newer gas engined thingies now white) start from under Sapan Taksin BTS along Charoen Krung rd. They serve this area as the roads are too small for big buses. Pay cash after getting off to driver -noone cheats though this would be very easy. Besides around 200+ normal big buslines BKK also has around 250 of such lines-many are just short shuttles up/down a sidesoi.
Personally I think all this hype about types of local food is what it is-grossly overhyped. Can hardly taste any difference. Real chunky soup from vegetables and stock in the western sense is very hard to find. Also as a general rule of thumb Chinese never sell for the lowest price-somehow they always charge 5 or 10 bt more, in the past even the 1 bt cup of ice was 2 bt with them. But perhaps thats why they are better bisnismen. Dont grab me over cheapness-I am just quoting prices I saw.

Tip/hint for others who may think of going VTE/Laos: any ASEAN does not need visa. Farang do, but that simply means paying 30/40US$ on entry-depends on your nationality. THai can even sneak in for a day or 2 with their ID only but are then restricted to the province of VTE, not whole country.
To cut the cost of going there-I will not recommend overnight train to NonghKhai+shuttle trainlet acros brdige-thats for diehard railfans. Nor the many overnight or also daytime long-dist. buses.
FLY to Udorn at domestic rate-also flights from that Pattaya airprt and take direct van/shuttlebus from airpt to Borderbridge and onward. Takes a ittle longer but can save nearly half the price. Its in fact only very recently that Laos allowed budgetflites in-they want to protect their own feeble state-airline.
And once again we see that here in TH nothing ever is the same-same for anyone anywhere-exceptions, in this case very nice ones (had those too last week) en sometimes not so nice are always to be expected. You make this story quite with some cliffhangers-so that people get very curious about what to happen next.

its definitely the worst of the options-the road is much faster, as its the triangle-shape: on the iron roads you travel via the longer 2 sectors.
THE world wide site for any Qs re trains is seat61.com, but do realise its anti-bus.
To the Q'depends on the train and the comfort wished for. In fact 3d cl canNOT even be reserved in most trains. There is 1 morning train which is more like a bus on rails and has only AC 2nd cl. Must be reserved-that comes together automatic with the ticket. May sell out on busy days. Also for the views its worthless: windows are opaque and as soon as there is a ray of sun any decent Thai closes the curtains etc. There may-or may not now-still be some food offered-think of a 20 bt box of rice with a few chickenpieces.
From around 14.00 the overnight trains to the far south start running, these vary in what they offer and their prices. 1st cl. is totally unnecessary for that sector-its an enclosed 2 berth compartment with AC, meant for sleeping overnight. Remaining empty space for NOT overnight (thus to HH ) will only be sold on the day itself and is due to all the supllmts. very expensive for the distance and only available on a few crack premium trains. Its now fairly easy to book yourself on the site of the SRT=State Railways-again see seat61 for the details. Expect late arrivals of 30 mns to hours-its mostly still single track so trains must wait for all the delays coming from south up.
BIG bus is now much fewer as before and leaves from the faraway Sai Thai NEW Terminal along the western ring rd. This is VIP or 1st cl. and should be 1st choice-except for the nasty dep.point and few trips left.  2nd cl is now all VAN=minibus, often with terrific speeding and idiot drivers, TiTs after all and go very often -ev 20/30 mins all together from various terminals. Sites like busbud or rome2rio are notorious bad informed about things bus here in TH-often relying on data from 5-10 yrs ago.
Most people/tourists in fact use the direct bus from Swampy airport. There are also a few direct buses from Mochit terminal, these come from further north.
@909-good luck tomorrow, its stillChin.NwYr so many a transpo is mobbed out.

The one advantage that CM always did have were its much lower prices-both for the drinks, the offs, the fees and the tips. (think of half the BKK-high end that you were exposed to till now). Also for most other things for the tourist-HTL, food etc-except the nasty transpo (but use grab now as way out). Nearly all working guys are indeed from whatever hilltribe, many Shan/Karyen (often slightly illegal from Burma-wandering tribes without much respect for passpt and all that idiot burocrazy stuff- thats how this world should be!) but alas, many seem to lack even the basic skills one may expect after Thai journeys. Even though CM can deliver delightful and very skilled guys-find these elsewhere, as they always seem to fear the gossip from next door if they would stay in CM city.
There is also a detailed and always uptodate site for gay things CMai and a poster who always delivered fresh news and pointed it out (bonton or so?).do a google for that.

its definitely the worst of the options-the road is much faster, as its the triangle-shape: on the iron roads you travel via the longer 2 sectors.
THE world wide site for any Qs re trains is seat61.com, but do realise its anti-bus.
To the Q'depends on the train and the comfort wished for. In fact 3d cl canNOT even be reserved in most trains. There is 1 morning train which is more like a bus on rails and has only AC 2nd cl. Must be reserved-that comes together automatic with the ticket. May sell out on busy days. Also for the views its worthless: windows are opaque and as soon as there is a ray of sun any decent Thai closes the curtains etc. There may-or may not now-still be some food offered-think of a 20 bt box of rice with a few chickenpieces.
From around 14.00 the overnight trains to the far south start running, these vary in what they offer and their prices. 1st cl. is totally unnecessary for that sector-its an enclosed 2 berth compartment with AC, meant for sleeping overnight. Remaining empty space for NOT overnight (thus to HH ) will only be sold on the day itself and is due to all the supllmts. very expensive for the distance and only available on a few crack premium trains. Its now fairly easy to book yourself on the site of the SRT=State Railways-again see seat61 for the details. Expect late arrivals of 30 mns to hours-its mostly still single track so trains must wait for all the delays coming from south up.
BIG bus is now much fewer as before and leaves from the faraway Sai Thai NEW Terminal along the western ring rd. This is VIP or 1st cl. and should be 1st choice-except for the nasty dep.point and few trips left.  2nd cl is now all VAN=minibus, often with terrific speeding and idiot drivers, TiTs after all and go very often -ev 20/30 mins all together from various terminals. Sites like busbud or rome2rio are notorious bad informed about things bus here in TH-often relying on data from 5-10 yrs ago.
Most people/tourists in fact use the direct bus from Swampy airport. There are also a few direct buses from Mochit terminal, these come from further north.
@909-good luck tomorrow, its stillChin.NwYr so many a transpo is mobbed out.

This Moonlight is where the OLD JUpiter used to be-beside what used to be calles the Suriwong hotel, now Bavana. They split and there is a jupiter 2000 with also gogo etc. in soi 4, I think even where some 30/40 yrs ago this phenomenon all started as Apollo.
Warning: ML is also much on the bucketlist of young single chinese GIRLs and they compete in hiring the model guys and will also come for the show etc.
The same applies since a few years for the once even so famous BoyBoyBoy in Pattaya-many though claim/say its the final straw for this club to survive.
As a general rule of thumb here in Thailand you can expect lesser real service from modelguys-simply just standing there to be admired and not getting their hands dirty or even wet is the norm, as many claim. As of course with any such rule-numerous exceptions too-you just wont know before what and how and noone will tell.

Selamat malam dari disini. Having arrived back here a few days ago I cannot confirm around 1/1 is busiest-at the mo its even more crazy and esp. with all types of Chinese, Taiwan/Honky, and esp. the mainlanders. And of course plenty from south of the border too, the faithful and always welcome malays. You must also suffer from the bad rate for the THB-I well remember it was always 10 baht for the ringgit, but its now under 8.
There are at least 2 new HTLs under construction in the Silom area, one will be an Ibis styles. So maybe next yr more chances.
How long will it take before those prized ML-shorties are starting to appear as copynearreal on the Silom stands..........

EU has also banned that years ago, but shops may sell sturdier bags. As always those least inclined to do that are the Brits-probably happy to reestablish all that when finally out. Some African countries even ban all plastics and search for it when you arrive at airports-Ruanda and/or Burundi, also ZA.
From what Ive noted the 3 days Iam here again: 7s, tesco and BigC will not do bags anymore. 7 still does if you buy heated mealboxes and all their straws and cutlery is plastic and in plastic covers too. The streetvendors still happily put anything in a bag, perhaps they have large stacks anyway.

Just a small note for those who are interested in such things: the town of Siem Reap (=THailand overwon after siege) had a pride week last may 19 and plans to have another one-around early may. Just read this as a note when searching for some other info on a site named movetocambodia.com, then search in the blogs. Either sponsored by gay establishments-wich means they must do pretty well or more likely-some NGO preaching and financing this.

Selamat malam dari disini. Having arrived back here a few days ago I cannot confirm around 1/1 is busiest-at the mo its even more crazy and esp. with all types of Chinese, Taiwan/Honky, and esp. the mainlanders. And of course plenty from south of the border too, the faithful and always welcome malays. You must also suffer from the bad rate for the THB-I well remember it was always 10 baht for the ringgit, but its now under 8.
There are at least 2 new HTLs under construction in the Silom area, one will be an Ibis styles. So maybe next yr more chances.
How long will it take before those prized ML-shorties are starting to appear as copynearreal on the Silom stands..........