Min

I started frequenting Thailand in my early twenties. Ate whatever I wanted, never exercised and did not sleep much. I was on vacation!

Nowadays, I've been trying to keep the same routine as at home. I have much longer stays in Thailand mainly because I can work remotely. So most of the day, I stay inside and do work. It also saves me tons of time on applying sunscreen  Also I stick to the gym for roughly 2 hours each day, usually in the afternoon (not weight lifting and heavy stuff, just running, push-up, sit-up, bar pulling to stay slim-fit) and may order an occasional massage after gym. My last stay in Poisedon was a disappointment (they claimed on Agoda they had a gym, but they didn't).
Although the night life is what makes it different from home, I tend not to stay too late anymore. I don't do LT so if I have an ST, night usually ends around 1 or 2 am.  
The good news from this routine is that whenever I walk into Silom Soi 4 or Jomtien Complex, many, especially farangs, still think I'm a freelancer, looking for customers (the fact that I'm Asian and look very much so may contribute), just like years ago. 

It looks like we share the same taste
Didn't you just call Vinapu as "other lads"?

You may have better luck if you widen your search a bit. If you did, my answer would be (1) Silom Road and (2) Surawong Road. The methodology is incredibly simple: scan for passing eye contact. 
 
Since long before Stonewall, gay men have been meeting other men mostly by eye contact. It’s brief but let’s you know there’s interest. It may well be a MB emitting what we now call gaydar. He’s essentially “pinging” us as we are “pinging” him. 
 
Last time I was pinged was last night about 9:45  when I was walking with a friend on Silom near Burger King. Even if it doesn’t lead anywhere it really boosts your spirits. 
 
You may not find your Thai boxer but a chance encounter can be a lot less time consuming and possibly exciting.

Day 12
Soon after they left  I realized that today is supposed to be a DAY for me as I hoped I will be able , after multi year waiting,  to off Handsome Cambodian  ( HC )from Jupiter, dream of mine for a good while. So by my own choice I switched  today to  “ wait for the evening “ mode.
Going for breakfast I notice Suwit waiting  already in front of  the shop , still closed that early , so grabbed him and we went for breakfast at BayView, it was actually nice , breezy morning.
As he knew , today I’m returning to Bangkok,  we kissed good bye  , literally in middle of the soi as neither of us is that shy. Then I went to the room to pack and at noon on the dot I left for Jomtien bus station to catch my 1 pm bus for which I bought ticket yesterday. I took motorsai for 50 baht.
Bus was full. Heavy traffic and it took 2 hours to get to Swampy so in the hotel I was close to 4 p.m.
You know what was on my mind all that time.
My hotel now for next 3 nights will be Furama Exclusive Sathorn, in sub soi close to both soi 3 where Baan Silom is and to Chong Nonsi station. After Raya,  it's becoming my most favorite hotel in Silom area , big rooms with balconies and breakfast included, no problems with visitors, there are always    some taxis, motorsais and tuktuks waiting outside and there’s cheap  local restaurant across the soi.  Breakfast is buffet type, not very sophisticated but varied and adequate enough with few Asian dishes so our guys may have choice they prefer.
As weekend was looming I went to XOne to exchange money, stocked there with 100 baht notes – I like them because they gladly provide few thousands in low denominations on request. I picked up glasses I ordered right after arrival, had banana pancake in soi where New Twilight is, then went to the room to spruce up and went to realize hopefully my dream and mission. But first stop  to get courage was at Hot Male downstairs, reader and anddy were there, tiny Lao was happy to see me again, always nice , enjoyable and not expensive time there.
After  9 , with pulse probably beating at 80 / my normal is 50-54 /  I marched to Jupter.
Not many people inside which was surprising considering it’s Friday but it was still early, artic cold and music volume at idiotic level but for now those were none of my problems. Drink ordered and I start looking around where my HC is. Nowhere, soon boys parade started, nope.
But I noticed that S, whom I offed from NewTwilight on my 3rd night moved to Jupiter now, during parade I slipped him 100 baht in exchange for smile. Offable material but not for price he wanted then and definitely not tonight for obvious reason.
 Very rarely I ask for mamasan’s help but there was no choice. Due to level of noise conversation , mouth to ear was like that  : “ is HC working today? “ , ‘ do you want boy?”, screaming ‘ is HC working today? “ , ‘’ which boy you want ?”, then he decided to ask another one to help   me . Answer was freezing ‘ not working today” but before I got heart attack or something soothing “ I can call him” came. 100 baht changed hands, in few minutes he came that HC will be here in 20 minutes so my pulse went down to normal I guess and I even feel that noise and cold is somewhat more bearable.
Finally he got there roughly at start of show , recognized me in the instant , after all we talked last weekend and quite possibly mamasan described that  “KFC looking idiot is asking for you “ or something. I asked if he wants to stay for the show, yes,  so we stay,  in meantime I secured long time ( finally!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ) , asked for expected compensation ( top of the line but not more that I was willing to fork out, I lost my head over him but some brain was preserved in the neck I guess and I had my limit ) so all looked good but he was sitting bit stiff as to avoid any casual body contact , arms crossed at times. Did not object my hand on his knee but  he did not bother with any touches , not that I expected much but I still be happy with even pat on the back.
After show it got better because we left, no problem walking, not hungry , we just bought some drinks at 7/11, he is talkative and English is good so my spirit went up. In the room no problem whatsoever , shower together OK,  body still lean and muscular,  all the same when I got struck seeing him  first time exercising with Art in front of BBB. So he took good care of himself during covid. Protested when  I told him he is so handsome, “I’m not handsome “ but when I told him ‘ for me you are “ , which in fact it is what I think,  he was happy. So thing were going very well  but they stopped when we moved to long time part.
“ Don’t do this’,  ‘ I don’t like this “, “ I’m tired and want to sleep “ etc.
 So I felt like cold water bucket was emptied over me as my romantic night  dreamed about for 3 or 4 years  turned to turf war over pillow and duvet.
 I was devastated  but not entirely surprised and thus not upset, only disappointed that dream of my own creation shattered , I  just gave up on being close . To his credit  in the morning he was not in rush at all, to a point that we missed breakfast in hotel   and converted himself to be more accessible.
So day 12 which I hoped will be day of days this trip  finished with me hanging my head low.
And is not HC fault, it’s mine as I hoped for much more based on my dreams.  
Now, few weeks since , I clearly see I was overreacting  , actually one of our members who knows HC brought me to my senses soon after saying rightly ‘finally you got him long time ! “
 But that morning, day after,  I felt dramatically disappointed.
I presented this story to readers to act as warning – we should not  build any hopes  beyond what we can reasonably expect in standard, after all commercial,  relationships.
 Result of this drama of my own creation is that yes , I will be still looking for HC whenever I’ll be in BKK, I will off him LT if he will be willing and I’d even consider him as trip companion.
 What I will not do is ask mamasan to call him and in fact any boy over, no,  I must see him eye to eye  like all other guys in bars. If there’s smile, it’s a deal, smile absent , next please. Day 12 is over.   
 

Hi Vinapu - I imagine that they are chatting with each other - and the reason that they are glued to their phones is because they need the Google translator program to communicate between them.  cut & paste the native text and then transmit in their respective language the message.
If it is not that - then perhaps they are selecting guys from the apps for a 3-some or 4-some later in the evening....

So you wanna meet me, another man who is intelligent, sweet, handsome, sexy, experienced, and manly 😁 kidding. Anyway, you sound really like @jason1975 very enthusiastic about many things
It looks like Jomtien Complex is back to normal business tonight.

Can we still pick up MBs from Lumpini park nowaday?
Still, but much more limited because of the apps. 20 years ago, it was the only way for us to find MBs. These days, there are 2 parks in Hanoi: Thong Nhat park and Hoa Binh park, the former located near the city center and much more accessible to foreigners. But again, I don't think you guys should venture out there on your own without a local friend to "chaperone". FYI: the on-going rate in these parks could be as low as 2 USD for a bj, 5 USD for ST and 10 USD for LT. Boys are mostly straight, fresh from a rural province, trying to survive in a big city.

Actually, since a picture's worth a thousand words, I went ahead tonight and took some pictures there in the Thong Nhat park, so you guys would have some ideas. All four boys in the pictures are MBs.

Somehow, I think this episode will be repeated with one more guy to join the festive group 😄

So you wanna meet me, another man who is intelligent, sweet, handsome, sexy, experienced, and manly 😁 kidding. Anyway, you sound really like @jason1975 very enthusiastic about many things
It looks like Jomtien Complex is back to normal business tonight.

So you wanna meet me, another man who is intelligent, sweet, handsome, sexy, experienced, and manly 😁 kidding. Anyway, you sound really like @jason1975 very enthusiastic about many things
It looks like Jomtien Complex is back to normal business tonight.

I'm not saying no, but not this trip as it was my last night in Pattaya and I returned to Bangkok as we learn when I post next day later today (or tomorrow for those who are in different time zone ).
While I liked those two multi boys nights I must state that my preference is still one on one . Multi boys may be more fun but one on one is more romantic. That gives me idea for next time if they still be there and I find them still attractive - dinner together than drinking in the room for fun part , then boys sent away   with exception of one designated to be romantic partner for that night.
Why I say " if I find them still attractive " ? This is a life . I don't meant particularly those three but most likely most of us experienced it in the past . Guy we salivated about last trip , all of the sudden doesn't seem to be so glorious now  even if nothing changed. Or even worse - he doesn't seem to pay any attention to us, avoiding even eye contact or pretending we never met.
Of course it works both ways, guy previously overlooked now shines like  a star and one who sported blank eye then, now is all smiles and winks. 
Actual off seems to be often breaking point. I used to have big hots for certain model offed him twice despite some antics on first off and only after 2nd time when those antics were repeated I realized that hots are gone for good. 
On another hand X featuring in my trip stories never paid any attention to me when he was in bar to extend then in order to off him I searched help of another member but after first , somewhat forced off we hit it on with multiple repeats. No double my handsomeness is the factor, otherwise what it could be ?
 

Somehow, I think this episode will be repeated with one more guy to join the festive group 😄

Day 11
Bay View restaurant was not opened  yet so for breakfast we went by baht bus all the way  to Kiss and despite early ( for Pattaya ) hours  they were quite busy, in fact I think we took last free table. We parted ways after that , I went again to exchange money, what else at such a pace and to Internet café to catch with my e-mails. Then some aimless wandering here and there.
Early afternoon I took motorsai , just for sake of supporting economy ( 60 baht) to Jomtien Complex to see Nara in his shop for good bye 1.5 hr massage. Driver dumped me on the main road and while passing by in one of massage shops I noticed quite handsome and muscly ,  heavily tattooed hunk and took note of his presence just in case. But I kept my plan , had massage with Nara, tipped him 2000 as it was our last meeting this trip and invited him for a meal to French restaurant on the corner as I wanted to taste that duck leg mentioned yesterday.
It was great but not better than one I’m making  I noted proudly. After meals we kissed out good bye, Nara is not shy guy. He went to his shop and I went to look for songtaew but recalled that handsome masseur and decided to see if he is still there.
He was so I just motioned and we went inside for another massage, session was good, he was muscular and well endowed , kissy,  huggy but there was something I did not like –strange odor coming from his skin. Not smell, not even unpleasant  but it bothered me. No idea what it could be – soap, some skin cream or other cosmetic, diet, result of taking some medication or substance , whatever it was , it spoiled my experience. I did not say anything, tipped him my normal rate 1000 / hr and went home bit disappointed as he was prime material for a night long session. Oh well , I need to find some substitution. And I got an idea who it will be, P and R from my first night in Pattaya and yesterday party in Dreamboys.
 So  I freshened up, shaved and went to Pickety for people watching. My yesterday’s guy was busy with guests  but it was Ok as my mind was fixed. After finishing beer changed sides to BBB, ordered some drink and asked mamasan about my guys. There weren’t  there yet but he assured me they will come as they are at the gym. Oiled with 100 baht tip , he even  called  them to confirm.
P showed soon , R bit later. L , our companion 2 night ago seeing what is going on stopped by hoping  he will be third but ‘just two tonight “ I said , consoled him with red note, paid 1000 off fee  and off we went to Bay View for a dinner passing by Suwit shop. He was not there but was keeping watchful eye from somewhere because soon after we sat down for a meal I got Line message ‘ two boys tonight my Casanova “ from him.
 In 7/11 we stocked on few beers and went to the room. Both are very talkative , P more on shy side , R quite opposite , undressed right away as he explained he doesn’t like chain of dress  when inside.
They told me a lot about their lives and friendship and at one point, I swear it was not my idea, P asked if his brother B whom we met last evening in Dreamboys can join. Holly molly thought I but of course  agreed, in few minutes phone rung and P went to pick him up downstairs. He looked even more handsome than yesterday and perhaps most manly of them three , explained by age difference.
 Thankfully we were well stocked with beer and also few snacks so we feed him and fun continued until time came to go to bed. I had 2 spare towels so showering was no problem but to keep things civilized I suggested I will shower with each of them separately. After all we have two brothers here.
Other guys were familiar with procedure from 2 days ago, B, last in line to get wet  was visibly shy, I sense he must be new in the business and never showered with customer before but he soldiered on with smile.
 When we emerged it looked  that other two boys not only made some order on the table after all that    drinks and snacks  but also thought well about bed arrangement reserving right half of bed for us two latecomers. That way brothers were separated by R and me , eliminated any brotherly awkwardness in such a situation.
 No , we did not have any foursome, that would be gross. I had three guys with me  to enjoy their company one by one so obviously at one point I switched places with R in order for P not to feel abandoned or discriminated . In process I understood what it means to sleep with the phone, R literally was clutching his all night.
It was fun and thanks to mutual co-operation and understanding we avoided anything we possibly could feel uneasy about recalling it later. Sure R emerged in the morning from under the sheets sporting glorious erection but from reaction of other two it was clear he is not shy in their room either , they all live together in one room with one more guy who I understand doesn’t  work in  a bar.
Morning distribution of tips ended such fabulous day 11, they declined offer of breakfast saying that they have food at home they want to eat otherwise it may be unusable later. Thank you my glorious boys  I thought after they left, what a night ! 

I was able to make it to this tonight and the atmosphere was festive for sure, though I do gather it's a similar atmosphere as usual. Unfortunately I don't have any experience of the Complex so I had nothing to compare it to.
I got incredibly lucky with Grindr and met up with a man who was intelligent, sweet, handsome, sexy, experienced, and manly at the party tonight. So, I will always have fond memories of this event.
 

right ! It was time when I was one of them , LOL
I even know somebody who offed him very recently and is extremely satisfied with experience.
Different people are looking for different things , be it muscle, bulge,  ass, face , personality, bed or massage skills  and any combination of those.
Even with our own preferences at times we can be in the mood to spice life with change. Certain KFC man likes hunks but is known to off twinks , even up to three a bed as was seen kissing with very diminutive Lao guy.
Over year I dragged few members , known twink lovers to Tawan, some run away screaming , some surprised themselves with liking the experience even if not necessarily guys on display there.
Sure Min has a point , what kind of model  chubby guy is ? ,  but  all that model game at Moonlight is just a spectacle , not a talent agency jamboree.
 

As a follow-up, even though I thought about giving the boy the benefit of the doubt and that he asked for payment in advance just for fear of being cheated, I heeded your advice and moved on to the next boy, who is 19 years old, from Isan, in Bangkok to study (he told me). He used to work part-time in a restaurant, lost his job due to Covid, never worked in a boy bar before.

We chatted on Grindr, he seems nice and very accommodating, answering all the questions without attitude. Asked for 2000 then agreed with 1500. So I told him to come to my hotel. I didn't know that at that point @jason1975 was doing more or less the same thing, in the same hotel (just different floor). I got lazy so I copied his narration  
Anyway, I could tell that the boy was really into me. He was all over me the moment I closed the door. He kept giggling and holding my face with both hands, saying "you are nice". After sex, we cuddled a little and a couple of times I tried to get up (it was time for me to hit the gym), he held me back for a few more minutes. When I gave him the money (the agreed amount + 200B for travel), he said in his broken English: "I like you but not as customer" hehe, so we are like brothers with benefits now? All in all, a happy ending.

Here are the two contestants representing Thailand and Vietnam in Mister National Universe 2022 just wrapped up in Thailand last week. I think the Thai contestant (who finished in top 10) has more of a Jupiter vibe, while the Vietnamese contest (who is the final winner) has more of a Moonlight vibe. So which one you would off and for how much? hehe

Day 10
For breakfast in Complex I have favorite place , French restaurant in the corner opposite  Soda massage so that is where we went. They bake baguettes on the site and I saw few people coming and buying them by the dozen. Certainly better than toast. I had regular America breakfast buy Nara ordered some exciting for me dish – duck leg confit. Duck is my favorite meat and at home Sunday’s dinner staple. So that had me already planning lunch together for tomorrow at the same place I told him.
For today I plan to stay in Pattaya proper to consume unexpected reunion with Suwit so after breakfast he went to the gym and I returned to Copa to pack and move to Classrooms in the next soi.
Girl on reception recalled me from previous stays or at least pretended to based on record they must have in their computer. Room , king bed with balcony was not ready yet so I left luggage with her  and went few steps to Paradise where Suwit met me with condemning look which did not stop me from ordering 1 ½ hr massage and his is a good one. Of course he threw again Casanova slur at me but softened the blow by calling me  ‘ my Casanova’, that’s something !. Such claim earned him confirmation that I will take him home tonight and not knowing what future brings I asked him to wait for me.
 Then  returned to Classrooms , room was ready , very spacious and comfortable  as all rooms there and after basically sleepless night and that massage I felt bit dizzy  so made myself a tea and collapsed on the bed for  a life restoring nap.
In the afternoon I went to exchange money, then to Das Berliner for a schnitzel. Dining alone I felt presence of biguyby our member with whom I dined there several times and who in fact introduced that place to me.  Since I left Bangkok I have problem accessing  my e-mail on the smartphone for some reason  so I went to internet café in soi Post Office but it was closed already so I went to another one just past TukCom . She was almost closing too but promised me at least 10 minutes which suited me well enough.
Next stop was to return to Boyztown and park myself at Pickety, host bar opposite BBB, beside Casto , in the place where Oscar used to be. One of their guys was very interesting but unfortunately he was already engaged serving farang  and his entourage of 4 guys so I invited another one , quite good looking too who did not waste any time and asked me to go to my room tonight but unfortunately I had already Suwit booked so disappointed him a bit.  
At one point I thought Chinese tours returned  but it turned out to be  group, judging by dress , well heeled Vietnamese of both genders who came to see Castro show. They were greeted with quite a reverence by their stuff including performers. Tonight I had plans to see XBoys so at 9.30  I paid my bill, tipped my guy 200 for sitting and entertaining me for good hour if not two and went to Pattayaland soi 1 where Xboys are but there things got derailed.
In front of Dreamboys opposite was standing A, former XBoys guy and show performer whom I offed LT three years ago. He remembered me and that off was to Classrooms hotel so I changed my plans and accepted his invitation to go to Dreamboys. I did not even go inside when I notice that at door standing and smiling at me is Soviet, old Cambodian acquaintance with whom I was sitting in Dramboys perhaps  5 years ago, then had massage with him at Royal House and after long hiatus last December we got reunited when I got drunk partying at Sabaidee in BKK  and guys there tasked him with   escorting me to hotel, where he accepted my invitation to stay for the night. I still recall waking up , half sober only to see naked guy sleeping beside, most likely his easiest LT ever even if we had some fun in the morning. So another unexpected reunion.
I invited both of A and Soviet for  a drink and as soon as we sat down , me being only customer inside,  whom I see in the scene ?. R, one of  two friends I was so impressed with two days ago in BBB and who it looks is moonlighting in Dreamboys as well. So fourth  drink was ordered and it become dense around me which I enjoyed quite a bit as none of boys was too shy and A is champion kisser.
And it was only start as few minutes later P, another of the pair from BBB showed up , another moonlighter there, next Chang  on the table and we have fun. In meantime bar started filling up , from time to time guys went to the stage as I warned them loyally I had guy for tonight so they don’t have a chance for an off from  me.  I noticed one guy who was quite handsome and pointed him to R sitting beside me only to learn that it’s B, P’s brother. What?  Call him over. I felt like emperor with court of 5 guys , one more handsome than another. So I ordered second round of Changs, told them it’s the last. We or at least certainly me had great time, sure it cost some money , 11 drinks plus each got 200 tip but it was money extremely well spent. Hugs , kisses and post 11 p.m. I left them certainly disappointed  but I have my duties tonight.
Suwit was waiting for me in front of Paradise, was not hungry, I had beer in the fridge so of we went to the room right away not noticed by anybody as entry to Classrooms is very discreet , separate card operated door. Good part of night we spent chatting and beering, not exactly dressed . At one point Suwit went to balcony to smoke completely naked and he did not care if he is seen or not. With good body like his he can afford such exhibition.
In the dark part was quite energetic, morning exercises lively and then to eternal shame I passed a bit of wind, not particularly fragrant or loud  but Suwit not missing the beat commented “ another boyfriend is calling you”. I love the guy ! Such was the end of day 10 and it means at some point past noon today it will be half mark of my trip, no wonder I lost wind control.

Can we still pick up MBs from Lumpini park nowaday?
Still, but much more limited because of the apps. 20 years ago, it was the only way for us to find MBs. These days, there are 2 parks in Hanoi: Thong Nhat park and Hoa Binh park, the former located near the city center and much more accessible to foreigners. But again, I don't think you guys should venture out there on your own without a local friend to "chaperone". FYI: the on-going rate in these parks could be as low as 2 USD for a bj, 5 USD for ST and 10 USD for LT. Boys are mostly straight, fresh from a rural province, trying to survive in a big city.

Actually, since a picture's worth a thousand words, I went ahead tonight and took some pictures there in the Thong Nhat park, so you guys would have some ideas. All four boys in the pictures are MBs.

@flashbarryallenyou can make it to the party, I believe  

Made my first visit to I-Come massage, a shop operated by those folks who bring us K-Man and KK massage.
Located on Soi Suan Plu (diagonally opposite Convent Road) off Sathorn, it’s about a 20-minute walk from Silom.
I was greeted by an Isan guy, Bee, who immediately understood what I wanted when I told him I didn’t want oil on this hot and sticky afternoon. This surprised me because most guys automatically revert to Thai massage when I say that.
The room was on the third floor with a new, round shower stall with warm water. As we got to talking, he told me used to work at the since closed Nakarat shop on Soi 4. That had been my favorite shop and was known for its stable of Thai, Vietnamese and Lao guys. Things began to click for me when he told me he remembered four of the Viet guys (among others) that I used to use there. 
Bee, who only returned to Bangkok three weeks earlier, has a wonderfully firm body that you can only get from doing hard manual labor.  It cried out to be massaged and that’s what I spent 10 minutes doing. 
Bottle of water on arrival (and much appreciated after the walk over). 
I’m happy to give this shop—and this guy—a thumbs up.👍 
Facebook link below. You can request bookings on line.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/category/Health-Spa/I-Come-Massage-107877260701650/
 

Can we still pick up MBs from Lumpini park nowaday?
Still, but much more limited because of the apps. 20 years ago, it was the only way for us to find MBs. These days, there are 2 parks in Hanoi: Thong Nhat park and Hoa Binh park, the former located near the city center and much more accessible to foreigners. But again, I don't think you guys should venture out there on your own without a local friend to "chaperone". FYI: the on-going rate in these parks could be as low as 2 USD for a bj, 5 USD for ST and 10 USD for LT. Boys are mostly straight, fresh from a rural province, trying to survive in a big city.

Actually, since a picture's worth a thousand words, I went ahead tonight and took some pictures there in the Thong Nhat park, so you guys would have some ideas. All four boys in the pictures are MBs.

Noted with thanks.
An MB boy in Vietnam told me this story: A middle-aged customer picked him up from a public park (where MBs in Hanoi often ply their trade) and they went to a short-time hotel nearby by the customer's motorbike. The boy was the driver, and the customer snuggled right behind him, hugging him tight, touching his genitals while they were on the way. The customer came before they even reached the hotel. So the boy just collected his fee and was on his way while the customer used the hotel to wash himself
This question may hit close to home for some members here.

Doesn't look like X's business in Samut Prakan was doing well
 Mr. KFC may help.
  Way to go, my tiny Lao boy, who I haven't met.
@vinapuif you ever need a Y, I know a willing Viet boy

I don't think many straight guys would have problems with this arrangement as to them, it's just work (like you are asked to do a gay porn together). Straight boys I know back in Vietnam certain don't. Some even offer "a discount" if you take their "brother" as well.
On the other hand, gay boys who are "sisters" with each other might mind. My offer for threesome was turned down twice in Pattaya (one in Toy Boy and another in a go-go bar used to be next to Nice Boys whose name I forgot). In each case, both boys wanted to go with me but separately. You can off him today, off me tomorrow. They wouldn't do it if their "sister" is around. It's too weird, they said.
It might hurt if they both get inside @jason1975 at the same time