Jimbillp
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Posts posted by Jimbillp
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On 7/29/2023 at 6:23 AM, vinapu said:
Some people don,t have sense if humor or simply don,t like animals.
6 hours ago, GoldMember said:I've never been to Fake. How is it on Songkran? I considered going on one of the evenings but then I saw a video of a huge queue that they posted on IG last year. Do they sell tickets in advance?
It’s so busy. Huge queues to get in and like sardines inside. But it can be a lot of fun. Depends a bit on the spot you find. If it’s the thoroughfare it can be intense jostling/shoving/grabbing!. Not for the claustrophobic. It’s mainly outdoor and they have the overhead pipe installations basicallly soaking you throughout. Fake works best going as a group of friends. And it’s 99% local crowd/SE Asian. If you do a Songkran you should do a night at fake. Much more authentic.
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21 hours ago, macaroni21 said:
True for me too.
Here's my two cents' worth (again). IMHO, it is important to distinguish the Bangkok scene from the Pattaya scene. They have been bifurcating for a long time. The Pattaya scene depended heavily on winter exiles from the Northern hemisphere, and we know where the trend is heading. Pattaya has never managed to be much of an attraction to the gay Asian travellers.
The Bangkok scene is a more complex story. Its three parts: gogo bars, massage, and social-and-dancing locales, are going on separate trajectories. I believe the social-and-dancing venues are doing fine. Business is robust, not just on Silom Sois 2 and 4, but also in places like Fake Club, etc. Bangkok attracts the Asian travellers. To the farang, it may be difficult to tell a Thai apart from another East or Southeast Asian, but eavesdrop on the language they use and it will be clear how much the Asian traveller is contributing to gay scene tourism.
The massage business looks relatively healthy too, though, as with all massage businesses around the world, there is always considerable turnover, i.e. shops exit the business, new enterprises start up. I credit this to the fact that the shops outside of the Silom-Surawong area continue to depend largely on local custom as their bread-and-butter clientele. Tourists are icing on the cake. The shops in the Silom-Surawong area are more tourist oriented, but because of the healthy flow of Asian tourists, they're doing OK.
More importantly, the massage shops continue to attract young men as workers. Understanding why they can attract young men into the industry whereas the gogo bars struggle to do so helps us understand the strategic mistakes the gogos bars made over the years.
The Bangkok gogo business: A part of me thinks their days are numbered. I would say that they are being killed by two things: the tea money and the horrible strategic mistake the market leaders made to expose themselves to the general public through relying on the non-sex-buying customer. Let me elaborate.
Tea money: While I don't have the insider figures, I think this is a key factor in the exorable rise in prices for drinks and offs. Of course, high prices limit sales volume. Tea money may also be the factor holding back gogo bars' reinvention. They don't seem to be able to try anything new, and I suspect this has to do with the terms of the tea money deal. As soon as bar tries to experiment with the business model, the tea-money-collectors will want to charge more.
Exposure: When the gogo bars began to welcome hordes of straight tourists, they basically put a jinx on their staff recruitment. It gets harder to recruit when the gogo boy is expected to put himself on stage for people to gawk at them, even worse then he is expected to be part of an explicit show. The calculus is like this: The boy will do it if there is a high chance of an off. But if the great majority of the audience are only there to gawk, the boy earns little for "shaming" himself. So recruitment falls off a cliff.
Here's something to observe when you're next in a gogo bar. Look at the ages of the performers in the Big Cock Parades or other explicit show items. They are the older ones. Dream Boys', Sol's and Tawan's stable now have a significant number of guys in their 40s. I doubt if they get off'd. So why do the bars keep them on their roster? Because they're the ones more likely to be prepared to show cock. The young ones won't do it.
There is another strategic mistake the gogo bars made. They have left too much of the management in the hands of gatoeys. I think some bars are run as employment-creation platforms for ladyboys. The mamasan's primary objective seems to be creating jobs for her fellow ladyboys. Shows with fancy costumes and lip-sync don't attract the the boy-offing customer. They attract the gawkers, which then reduces the boys' chances of getting off'd, which then exacerbates the shaming the boys have to endure for working in a gogo bar.
Yes, the economic progress that Thailand has made, the rise in wages, have generally made it less attractive or necessary to work in the sex industry. But the massage parlours have no difficulty recruiting. Only the gogo bars. So, economic progress does not explain everything, which is how I came to the view that the the factors unique to the gogo bars - exposure, gawking, ladyboy acts - are the real killers.
I have a slightly different take. Having had a couple of night’s people watching and sort of killing time over busy festive period you see that the gogos in the areas with a large footfall/good barkers are doing really well with a fast turnover. I observed inside banana and Jupiter that so many (primarily groups - gay and mixed) are in and out in less than half hour. Ok it was the busy season but I estimate a lot of seats see usage by three/ four different backsides over the evening. It’s something they are cajoled to try and add to the ‘bangkok bucket list’. I bet most think it’s a bit naff/seen that done that and wouldn’t come back. The ladyboy element is though vital to that bucket list / classic Bkk entertainment. That’s why the prices are really inelastic. Whether you pay 500 or 250 to enter/drink you’ll never do it again. But I doubt the 250 difference stops many ‘having a go’ that one time.
fwiw this time I found banana bar best all round entertaining and to have some humour/energy to the show albeit too much ladyboy singers for me. Jupiter definitely has it right at the moment though, great line up and raunchy shows but without the more desperate feel of wham, bam here’s my big cock but with no creativity to it. moonlight needs a rethink, really dropped off but maybe that’s me
I’ll finish by saying Vinapu is our sage leader and has it right. Variety is the spice of life, and bkk has plenty of that. What other city could offer gogos/night clubs where after a fortnight you wouldn’t have repeated yourself at all?!
ps Marconi, love your reporting and the prose. Please keep educating/entertaining us
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2 hours ago, 18past19 said:
it was around 1 am near Fake club last Songkran. We first attempted to get into Fake club, but it was completely packed and the line waiting outside was super long. so we gave up Fake club and instead went to a different one nearby.
I was in fake club. You literally couldn’t move at times! But a lot of fun across Songkran festivities
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I’m probably the trinity Silom regular Vinapu refers to, and yes the clincher for me is the large pool with great views on 8th floor. I never take the breakfast. So many local market and coffee shop options. The walk is fine to the main areas. Look for it on agoda where it can be a really great price. I’ve got some December 2023 nights at around 1000 baht. It can go very expensive at times too.
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I did make it into Fake club on Thursday night. It was so packed. Difficult to move around at times. Took 20 mins to do one return toilet visit. The upside was being packed in like sardines with many of asias finest men has it’s pluses. They rig up scaffolding that has sprinklers so you spend most of the four hours being drenched. But the temperatures make it a blessing. I got home 5 am that night. Their Facebook has some great pics of their performers.
Last night i was on soi 4 - having not got near DJ - it similarly was heaving and an effort to get into and down the soi but great fun. like an outdoor disco once you found a spot. So much eye candy and you end up partying with whoever is nearby. Great dj set too from a booming sound system.
Songkran has been a blast. Silom is booming. Feels like Every gay South Asian lad has come for the pilgrimage.
The energy and fun is infectious and once you accept you will be soaked you’re in. The temperatures make it a blessing. It could be by a little kid or grandma through to a posse of massage shop boys.
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That may have been me! It is really steaming hot and humid. Even in Jupiter their industrial aircon can’t make it chilly! And they had something else different - a very energetic, exotic and entertaining burlesque type dancer as part of their show
expect a lot of my daytime will be spent sheltering inside, even the evenings it hits you - that hot air oven type feel
just need the water fights now to cool down……
other observations, bangkok really is back to ‘normal’.
this is third post covid visit and the first where if you hadn’t been told you might not know anything much had even happened. Pretty much everything is open and flourishing. Looks like both Screwboys and the ‘new’ Queens will also soon be welcoming patrons
just had big night out in fake club with Thai friends, still my favourite for a more local and club like night out experience. Only saw one other westerner in whole place, but definitely a lot more women and girls now attending. Maybe 25%. Adds to the inclusivity.
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Having been on that trip to Grand Palace and reacquainting with Sam last month I can confirm his positive disposition, and he was recalling happy moments and pictures with you even then so I can imagine the big smile when he saw you
so it was surely destiny he was the solace for your bounce back night, and restored some positive ambassadorial role for the Cambodians
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Well he was planning to go to BKK with you as he told the other guy from the bar the plan. Usually it’s the least dramatic but most obvious reason. I’d guess He concluded (wrongly) you weren’t going to play along enough with his high expectations (didn’t send the further money or bring the case) and he decided to bail as he wasnt confident he would manipulate enough from it.
looking forward to the rest of the report and your bouncing back
- Ruthrieston, floridarob, Boy69 and 1 other
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Talk about a virus knowing a virus when it sees one.
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Again we have small world coincidence!, I’ve just chatted to the guy who came to the grand palace with us at hotmale. His face lit up when I showed him the photos he’d taken for me back then. It clearly was special to him. And for us - That day when it felt like the grand palace had opened especially for us…..
- Ruthrieston and reader
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It is funny coincidence that your last night included A and the pinoy boy as I enjoyed their company last night. Of course we remembered Vinapu as I had previously met A at the top of the big tower with you. Perhaps knowing you are honorary patron of Thai happy bar restaurant A marched us there and ordered most of the seafood menu before I’d barely sat down! Then the host Joy declared her undying love for V by ordering a Singha on my tab and saying ‘on you’. Haha. All in great spirits.
A is actually very kind guy as he had taken the young non Thai speaking Pinoy under his wing. I do recommend people visiting Moonlight to look for the Filipino. His English is excellent and he has super energy and personality.
I thought Moonlight show very samey and not enough spice. For a long time my fav bar but losing allure. Although to counter that I found two great guys in the line up.
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I can report from a recent visit to Jupiter that Mr Boom was very much there with his hula hoop, that’s some hip swivel and also in other numbers where he and other Jupiter shows have increased the disrobing. In my mind to just the right balance now of very sexy model show without being too blatant.
- vinapu, Ruthrieston, yp11 and 1 other
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An anonymous poster claiming they will sue for slander. So who is being defamed? A made up screen name?? Not the brightest!
- SolaceSoul and Latbear4blk
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Another epic trip. And I love the way you in effect double your enjoyment by writing it up over a similar time period to the trip itself thereby reliving all the experience - and of course sharing with us. You bring a very healthy and can do approach to having a great holiday in Thailand.
It was great to overlap with you at the beginning of your travels and we will always have that time we had private viewing of the Grand Palace all to ourselves. -
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On the quarter:
Modern and clean. Room is compact and a bit short of clothes storage space. Super fast Wi-Fi and good shower. Balcony is tiny.
Good gym with modern equipment. Swimming pool a bit goldfish bowl alongside restaurant. Very small sauna and steam.
I got a great rate in May. At their full rack rate I’d probably judge the room a bit too small but the Wi-Fi was fantastic for working.
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Recently went to Thailand (mid May) and here are a few observations on what was a different Bangkok but also reassuringly familiar.
Thai Pass so easy and airport arrival and entry smoother and faster than ever.
Bangkok is still really quiet, which brings advantages of low accommodation costs and always getting a seat in a restaurant. At times it is too quiet, that buzz of a big city and nightlife not there, but then there are advantages…..
I thought I was done with the Grand Palace and Wat Pho but an instinct it might be crowd free led to an 8.30 arrival with board member vinapu. And what a visit. It was like a private viewing! We were less than six people in total viewing the Emerald Buddha, and had the hall of the reclining Buddha and many courtyards to OURSELVES. I now have some amazing photos recorded digitally such was length of time since last entry. When we caught the boat back they had to radio for it to stop so few were the passengers waiting to head downstream.
I enjoy the show bars for the entertainment rather than the taking off and here they were largely reduced in spectacle but the glass half full were how many were trying their best to get going sometimes with very low audience members. In Jupiter there were perhaps 25 brazing the air con at best and Moonlight on a Saturday had 15 at best and a much shorter show from only the models themselves. There does seem even more of a clear demarcation between the more no holds barred (Tawan/Hot male) and the fashion model parade (Moonlight, Jupiter, New Twilight). Be interesting to hear what relaxed opening and bigger visitor numbers brings. New Twilight has some money and energy behind it and is the most comfortable viewing experience, be interesting what next for them.
maybe half the massage shops are empty or gone but plenty of choice at the others and walk in spaces at Prime which is the quality offering. MBK really shows how hard times have been with less than half the units occupied esp the smaller outlets
I have some Thai friends and this saw a visit to Fake Club. This required a 120 baht swab test for entry with a nurse administering on the door. Felt very down beat on entry to be literally first customers at 10.20pm, buy by midnight it must have been 100 plus and was good fun with lots of time to chat to some very attentive models including Spai who appears to have transferred from Jupiter. A visit to DJ station on a Friday night with several Thai friends was the other extreme as it was so busy there were times you literally couldn’t move. It was like a subway train in peak rush hour. But this novelty was kinda fun after nearly three years. Bit bizarre to wear a mask all week on empty streets then no mask in a packed, indoor night club.
As ever good to meet some new faces as well as the irrepressible @vinapu and also to catch up again with super guy and knowledgable @paulsfand @anddyover the week
My last night saw all bars closed for an election, so took chance to try the local Sauna Mania. It was very busy and 120 baht to enter and as probably the only Farang there lots of interest and opportunity with no feeling of exclusion.
I did find the heat and humidity a bit constraining and wouldn’t rush back in May but once again found my time in BKk, and the few days spent exploring the North, as rewarding as ever.
So my advice is you only live once. go now before the world has come back, enjoy the quiet, and add to those special memories.
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The premium class was full. It’s only 18 seats. The rest looked about 75%. Interesting the best economy seats they charge more for including front row with leg room were empty both directions. Seems opting for the £200 ticket at the back very popular.
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Return leg just completed. Fast check in. Took off only about 15 mins late. Scoot plus as described before, a premium economy seat with basic frills.
30 mb free Wi-Fi worked. The meal included is basically one of those 99 baht 7 eleven microwave deals! Take snacks and all goodin flight entertainment. Well, you do get one of those lift up from the are rests trays you could use, or you could wrap your tablet in bubble wrap, or even let it potentially slide all of 50 cm to a carpeted floor!
only downer was the hour wait for baggage, but that’s Gatwick’s screw up not Scoot.
All in all delighted with what I got for £830 direct flight return. However I see in next few months they are charging around double that no doubt capitalising on their lack of competition for direct flights.
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I used Scoot to get to Bangkok last week. Give everything a go once is my motto. I used the scoot plus hoping it equated to premium economy in a standard full service airline and that’s just what it is.
Just be prepared for no in flight entertainment (easy if you have a tablet or read) and less food (I brought some snacks), one average meal was included and you could buy more.
check in line was slow, but fine once I realised with plus you could go round the side with premium.
main issue was we were sat on plane for 2 hrs before journey started, they said this was a Gatwick airport issue with short staff and take off paperwork being cleared. Hmmm!? Others on here are better at looking up their regular punctuality.
anyway, overall it is a serviceable, direct route. If you really want to save money go in back of plane and travel in standard short haul type seating. It was busy and not surprisingly looked very backpacker types
would I use again? Well I have a return so am next weekend!
but yes, I’d use their premium again if it was a decent saving over equivalent direct with Thai, Eva or BA
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Better to be retired than retarded - Thailand and Cambodia in January 2024. Trip report, brief but long.
in Gay Thailand
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I was very pleased my last night overlapped with your first and we got chance for a good catch up. You are the sage of Bkk wisdom with the perfect glass always half full approach to life. I look forward to reading rest of your trip report and hope fate brings us back to Thailand at the same time once again