Will they make it?

[hank75]

 As Thailand starts to reopen, a quick straw poll to see where members’ opinions lie about the recovery of go go bars. I am referring mainly to the Silom scene as Pattaya bars have already been besieged by other issues even pre pandemic, but opinions on Pattaya too are welcome. 

A couple of boys and bar staff I spoke to have suggested, based on current government policies, a mid June reopening of bars seems realistic. However most of you will also have read the latest news that international inbound flights are now banned until 1 July. No word yet if a lengthy quarantine will be imposed even after the ban is lifted. This means tourism will be impacted until at least end July or early August, the start of the rainy season and the usual low income period for bars. Should bars reopen in June, they will be dependent on expats and the rich foreign customers who weathered the lockdown in Bangkok for at least six to eight weeks if flights do not resume. 

Right now the bars are not paying salary to their staff, most of whom have returned to their hometowns. Based on social media posts they are all keen to get back to work, so diminished numbers should not be a problem. Those who have not left Bangkok are already active on apps and for private massages. Bar owners have incurred at least 2-3 months of rent (perhaps some are still repaying bank loans) with no income. Does it make sense to reopen bars despite lack of tourists, and take on salary and operation costs on top of rent? As we all know, bars only make income from cover, drinks, and off fees. 

[Vessey]

A Pattaya bar owner that I know (ST girlie bars), says that for him there is a big distinction between when he could legally open his bars again, and when it would be financially prudent to do so.

He says he will make a judgement as to when sufficient tourists are arriving to make it financially viable to open again, but admits that could still be many months away.

I am guessing boys bars will all be making similar calculations.

[Boy69]

I don't think bar owners will open their business immediately when it will be legal to do so if there are still restrictions on tourists arrival and the Corona situation all over the world is not clear yet .I assume bars will he fully operated not before the next high season on December 2020 .

[vinapu]

I think about 1 month after all restrictions are lifted things will resemble what we remember as normal. It will be some casualties but this happens all the time , virus or not .

Some guys will disappear and some new talent will show up, just like always.

Key word is 'all restrictions are lifted" as very few of us will be that horny as to risk quarantines on arrival in Thailand and again when returning home.

Everybody will be making their calculations , bar owners , landlords and guys but if demand will appear, offer will spring in it's wake overnight.

[Londoner]

There are two of us- one stuck in his farm in Kamphaeng Phaet district, and one marooned in South London- who are desperate that  vinapu's prediction is accurate. It's the longest we've been apart in nearly eighteen years. October is our target month. At the moment.

[TotallyOz]

The world's oldest profession will survive and thrive. If you build it, they will cum. There will be a slow opening and many won't go but as things get safe, more will. I have seen the apps busier than ever and people wanting to me and MB's wanting (needing) income at any cost. Bars are not the only way to get it done, but in Thailand, they are usually a sure thing.

[spoon]

It is temporary. Unlike wars or drastic change in political believes (modern example of north korea and numbers of middle east nation), no diseases have stopped horny human from having sex, paid or free.

[hank75]

Thanks, my question wasn’t if the sex trade will continue (it will, luckily for most of us) but if the bar scene that most of us are used to will survive after the owners have several months of close to zero income. Especially some of the venues that have undergone recent expensive renovations after moving from Soi Twilight. Perhaps they will and this is just temporary. Or perhaps owners may decide it’s just too costly to run a full go go, while beer bars or massage shops makes better financial sense. These are unpredictable times indeed. 

[PeterRS]

The bars lasted through the early years of the much scarier HIV pandemic. In fact they increased in number. They lasted through three years of the Asian Economic Crisis. They lasted through the 2008 global financial recession. The main difference in recent years has been the replacement of Thai boys with others from neighbouring countries. My view is that in future it will become more difficult for Lao, Cambodian and Vietnamese to return for quite some time after the bars reopen. But like the 1980s, 1990s and 2000s many Thai boys may now be desperate for decent paying work. Maybe they will return to the bars.

There are two huge differences between 2020 and the three instances I refer to above.

1. international air travel. IATA has stated it will be 2024 before flights return to their 2019 level.

2. Disposable incomes of millions of possible gay travellers have taken a big hit. 

If flight prices rise to a point where gay tourists decide they just cannot afford to fly to Thailand, what happens to the demand for the bars over the next year or two? Bars can probably survive a shutdown for a few months. Can they survive a major drop off in customers lasting years?

[spoon]

PeterRS has detailed up the responses pretty well above. Sex trade is the business, and bars is just the medium. And to me and all of us that adores thailand, a unique medium compared to many other places in the world. I can get massages here in malaysia, or pretty much everywhere i travel to, i can get MB from apps all the same. But a gogobar, with mamasan, the boys, the show, the intimacy inside the bars, the thai hospitality and of course affordable, is what kept is coming to the LOS. For me, other than LT, i lose cost advantages compared to what i can  get back home, but there is nothing close to what the gogobars offers in thailand that i can get back home, especially the quality, variety, and huge quantity of boys all in one convinient place that a bar hopping can be done in one night. So due to this reason, i do believe its a temporary setback. 

Onwers of the bars might change hands but once the disease is contained, the bars will resume. 

[Travellerdave]

My belief is that the pandemic will subside to manageable levels towards the end of this year. International air travel will resume subject to precautions against infection and at a rather higher cost. The Thai economy is highly dependant on tourism and the nation has escaped relatively unscathed from the virus. Many gay tourists, including myself,  have a high level of disposable income and have a desire to spend time in Thailand where the culture is welcoming. I think a small number will start arriving in a few months joining gay expats and will want sex with Asian boys and will first find them using the apps. A big moment will be the emerging of a small number of open bars where gays congregate and where boys will come to find them, looking for an income much higher than that to be found on the farms and factories. Gogo bars will open rather later. These are my hopes and I try to keep in touch with the scene by logging onto this board and another, awaiting my possible next trip during late 2020 early 2021.

 

[Londoner]

There have always been more go go and host bars than the clientele can support. Even in 1995, the year of my first visit, there were bars in  or near Boyztown that were almost empty and had closed by the time I returned. It was the same in Bangkok, Patong and Chiang Mai. And that pattern continued for twenty plus years. In Jomtien, of the twenty or so host bars (yes, I counted one evening) there were three or four that were always empty when I looked  apart from a couple of bored hosts. 

A culling of bars of 20, 30 or even 40% would be very sad for the owners but not  necessarily for the staff, who would find employment elsewhere, and certainly not for the punters. Everyone knows that a vibrant, busy bar draws customers, just as a vibrant, busy soi does.

[reader]

Judging by the gussy upped old scheme authorities rolled out today--one that seems doomed to fail because it ignores the obvious, Thailand again wants to prove that it can perform a grand makeover and revive tourism by catering to the well heeled who come the country to enjoy the beautiful seaside and culture. Consider these excerpts from today's Post:

Thailand plans to rebrand tourism in the post-coronavirus era to "Amazing Trusted Thailand", aimed at selective markets and destinations in the country that can guarantee health and safety standards for both tourists and locals.

"Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha suggested we use this opportunity to rebrand Thai tourism as a quality destination where we care more about trust than carrying capacity."

With Thailand looking to exit lockdown this month, TAT is preparing a strategy for the second stage -- matching foreign tourists from countries that were removed from the list of "Disease-Infected Zones for Covid-19" with select provinces that never reported infections, or provinces that have not had a new case in the past 28 days.

Islands such as Phuket or Samui may be the first batch of destinations to welcome international tourists as their geography allows authorities to more easily control and keep track of tourists.

Thailand is looking at high spenders within the region, such as Singapore, China and Vietnam, to visit designated areas in Thailand under a quota.

These tourists can visit selected destinations without being subjected to 14-day quarantine measures, but they have to provide health certification, fit-to-fly certificates and buy health insurance before visiting Thailand, while rapid testing will be available upon arrival.

It's built partially on the assumption that tourists from these countries have no place else to go so they'll obviously pour into Thailand. That's  based on the highly unlikely assumption that other nations--also seeking to revive tourism--will sit on their hands while everyone with money packs off to the LOS.  It also assumes that this will put a sizeable dent in lost tourism income.

Readers who've been coming to Thailand for more than a few years know that those aren't the tourists who fill the hotels, buy the street food and patronize the traditional entertainment areas. Those tourists come from far and wide and without them the ecosystem of bars, restaurants, clubs and other venues that they support will disappear.

The idea that Thailand can somehow alter a formula that has created an industry responsible for 20% of its GDP is a wet dream a minority of hi-so planners keep returning to whenever they see an new opportunity presenting itself. But neglecting the livelihood of thousands of day-to-day earners has never proven a plan--in any nation--that's conducive to good public order and preventing political unrest.

Tourism rather will be revived when people believe that the Thailand they know from the past will still be there when they arrive.

 

[spoon]

I wonder if phuket opens up, boys will go there to work instead and gay scene there will be revived...

[Londoner]

I'm not sure that "revived" is the appropriate word. Patrong was dead on my first visit in 1998, alarmingly so to a first timer. I've visited five or six subsequently times-admittedly never in the highest of the high season- and have only seen it busy on Youtube. It is also expensive and I suspect that the workers may find their living expenses higher than  in Pattaya and this would be a major concern for them.. I enjoy it as a tourist destination but the gay scene I find depressing. Perhaps the apps are more successful....I don't know

Another issue is that Pattaya has  a fair number of gay expats who play their part in the bar-scene....has Phuket? I really don't know.

 

[hank75]

Today’s news...

Bars may reopen sooner than expected 

The government’s Centre for Covid-19 Situation Administration reported today that pubs, bars and entertainment facilities would be permitted to reopen in the coming weeks if the regular count of new Covid-19 cases remains in single digits.

Dr Taweesilp has confirmed that the Covid-19 situation in Thailand continues to improve and has dropped to single digits for the past 22 days.

“The CCSA will continue to assess the situation every 14 days and if the single digit trend continues, the reopening of “red” businesses (medium to high risk) is likely to come faster.”

He added, that everyone should keep their guard high to maintain the low infection rate, which would help everyday life to return to normal and boost customers’ confidence in “red” businesses.

And whilst the re-opening of bars and pubs will be welcome, businesses are wondering who will be be visiting them. Bars in the tourists strips of Bangkok, and in tourist locations like Pattaya and Phuket, will likely be running on empty until the tourists start flying back into the country.

[Boy69]

59 minutes ago, Londoner said:

I'm not sure that "revived" is the appropriate word. Patrong was dead on my first visit in 1998, alarmingly so to a first timer. I've visited five or six subsequently times-admittedly never in the highest of the high season- and have only seen it busy on Youtube. It is also expensive and I suspect that the workers may find their living expenses higher than  in Pattaya and this would be a major concern for them.. I enjoy it as a tourist destination but the gay scene I find depressing. Perhaps the apps are more successful....I don't know

Another issue is that Pattaya has  a fair number of gay expats who play their part in the bar-scene....has Phuket? I really don't know.

 

Paradise complex at Patong beach was very lively between 1999 to approx. 2006 when I made couple of visits there the gay scene was modest in comparison to Pattaya or BKK but still enjoyable with many attractive working boys at bars and freelancers after midnight but the complex declined constantly, my last visit there was on 2017 it was so depressing that I made a decision never to visit Phuket again : low number of available boys and gay venues, filthy beaches and high leaving cost . enough is enough.

[newalaan]

With regards to Bangkok, perhaps a chance to consolidate the gay gogo/bar scene in Patpong 2, as per previously on Soi Twilight. I see from 'stickman weekly' site he reports that 2-3 lady gogo bars on Patpong 2 are not going to reopen after lockdown no matter what happens, so maybe a chance to fully establish Patpong 2 as the 'gay soi', even he is suggesting that possibility.

Given that Thailand hopes for Asian country customers to return first, as was the case pre-lockdown, where well-off Asians...….Chinese, Sth Korea, Singapore, Hong Kong etc were the main customer base that gives a real hope that they, along with any Bkk expats can offer hope, certainly initially until we see just what the full Covid damage will be in terms of International travel from Western countries as well as the Asian one's. 

Although it seems the fall-out will be much worse than 2008 Financial crisis, that crisis showed there were still enough gay travellers with deep pockets who still had the will and means to travel to Thailand and visit the gogo bars and entertainment areas.  

[gerefan]

On 5/19/2020 at 1:17 PM, reader said:

These tourists can visit selected destinations without being subjected to 14-day quarantine measures, but they have to provide health certification, fit-to-fly certificates and buy health insurance before visiting Thailand, while rapid testing will be available upon arrival.

That will be the killer for Western tourists. Imagine the USA  and the UK being on any “approved list”.

And who is going to be able obtain the medical certificates? In the UK all doctor surgeries and hospitals are effectively closed to anything but life threatening problems.

As for covid insurance...forget it!

 

On 5/19/2020 at 1:17 PM, reader said:

 

 

[Travellerdave]

Here in the U.K. there is the feeling that international travel In the late summer and autumn will be more likely than It seemed a month or so ago. Airlines and travel operators are starting to advertise schedules from July onwards. In Thailand a big moment will be when alcohol can be served in restaurants and bars. The world is full of potential tourists who love Thailand who are eagally awaiting for conditions to permit a visit. Many affluent gays are definitely in this category. In Bkk and especially in the resorts, opening a bar will require much less capital Than previously given the huge availability of premises. 
I love to think that a trip to Pattaya during the period August to October will be possible to get my “fix” of the atmosphere and especially of Asian boys who will come back from Isaan drawn by the money. I am following the blogs about this  on YouTube with interest !

[hank75]

Looks like the verdict will be out today. From The Pattaya News.

CCSA to meet with leading nightlife, entertainment, bar, Alcohol industry representatives and musicians on Sunday to discuss unlocking entertainment venues

Bangkok-

Dr. Taweesin Visanuyothin, spokesperson of the Center for Covid-19 Situation Administration, stated this weekend that Prime Minister Prayut Chan-O-Cha has stated that he wishes to see all professions return to work and making an income.

This follows a public and increasing petition and pleading from musicians, the entertainment industry, The Tourism Authority, the Thai Alcoholic Beverage Industry and even members of Parliament to allow Thailand’s world famous nightlife and entertainment industry to begin to re-open and allow people to return to work.

The entertainment industry is essentially the only major exception to being closed currently as Thailand has relaxed restrictions on what they state is 95 percent of previous closure orders.

However, with the Thai Tourism Authority starting a renewed push for domestic tourism, having the entertainment and nightlife industry re-open is a substantial part, even without international flights allowed into the country with foreign tourists.

According to some industry estimates the domestic Thai entertainment industry, or bars and nightlife catering only for Thai’s, is as much as 80 to 90 percent of the overall entertainment industry. Additionally some parts of the country, like Pattaya, Koh Samui and Phuket rely on entertainment venues for the majority of their attractions and appeal.

As a result, a large meeting has been scheduled with all relevant parties and the CCSA tomorrow, Sunday June 21, 2020. This meeting is expected to directly address when and how entertainment venues can re-open.

It is important to note that there is no promise or firm date ahead of the meeting on when venues will reopen. However, with wheels in motion and Thailand expected to hit 28 days Monday without a single confirmed locally spread case of Covid-19 recorded, the date is likely in the near future.

 

[vinapu]

In meantime we can start dreaming, just part -time for now

[hank75]

Bars and clubs can re-open soon, but with a list of 22 requirements

Well, there’s some good news and there’s some bad news if you’re the owner of an entertainment venue in Thailand. You CAN re-open… soon. BUT, the CCSA has put together a list of 22 requirements you’ll have to meet when you re-open your doors.

Not surprisingly the owners and representatives are unhappy about the long list of encumbrances on venues who will re-open under the new phase 5 guidelines. The list of rules is being submitted to the Centre for Covid-19 Situation Administration this Friday.

Of businesses left to re-open in Thailand, the entertainment industry includes pubs, karaoke outlets, massage parlours and other types of adult entertainment venues. Shuttered since March, the venues are eager to open in July.

Here’s some of the main restrictions, among the long list…

• Restrict the number of customers

• Check body temperature of patrons and provide hand sanitiser

• Groups of people sitting together – maximum 5. They will have to sit 1 metre away from each other.

• At least 2 metres between tables, or install barriers

• No singing or dancing (that includes your club team song after the 9th beer)

• Drinks in glasses only, not bottles

• Staff must wear face masks AND face shields

• No ‘gathering’, ‘shouting’, or ‘wandering’

• Musicians and performers must wear face shields (who wants to hear those silly lyrics anyway!?)

• No competitions or group activities, including pool and darts

• Ensure social distancing in smoking areas

• Ban ‘product presenters’ from sitting with guests (huh?!)

Last week the country’s musicians and entertainers pleaded with the the government to allow them to return to work. They told officials that they were in dire financial straits.

Operators say limiting customers to five in a group may keep them from coming and are complaining that the rules for entertainment venues are stricter than the ones imposed on eateries and filming crews.

But, keen to pry their doors open again, operators admit they will have no choice but to comply with the new rules. In the meantime they are urging the CCSA to reconsider the draconian list of restrictions and consider relaxing the rules, either before Phase 5 starts or a few weeks after.

There is no doubt the country’s battered entertainment industry will take time to recover. In towns around Thailand the locals will likely trickle back as more confidence is gained in social gatherings again. But for the tourist spots, many former businesses will simply go broke as the government delays opening borders for international tourists. Many will never re-open. Some 2 million people are employed in the country’s entertainment and nightlife business.

Meanwhile, Deputy PM Wissanu Krea-ngam says the government will consider the lifting of the emergency decree by this Friday.

Mr Wissanu says the decision whether to lift or extend Thailand’s emergency decree will be made based “on the assessment of Covid-19 risks”.

“If the country does not face a second wave of infections, then the Communicable Disease Control Act is adequate to contain the virus.”

[anddy]

sounds like a no-go for the go-go's. But they don't have customers anyway, so wouldn't be economical to reopen anyway. Can't imagine locals, expats and a few stranded tourists being enough for a viable business. 

Also, no DJ Station etc... 

[vinapu]

At least they can open and see what happens. Being closed is not viable for sure. Slowly but surely we are getting closer and closer to normalcy